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HelicopterHIROBOOther › Helping stabilize unstable blades in the Freya
05-31-2004 08:39 AM  13 years agoPost 21
Helinutnz

rrElite Veteran

below 42 South

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grip flipping

Guys I am just building my head now. Should I do the grip flip? I only just removed the dampener bolts and cleaned them up and reinstalled them with locktite (red) so will I get away with that for a while before needing the through bolt mod of augusto's? By the way they came out real easy!!! thanks. P.S Sluggo.....was your sluggo/xpec vid done with the grips in the trailing position?? If so and you say your heli is flying like it's on crack now then it must be impressive!
Glenn

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05-31-2004 08:55 AM  13 years agoPost 22
Garry-Boy

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Moscow, Russia

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It's very kind of Hirobo, to make a mechanics adjustable for various deltas e.t.c. We all must say thank you!
The only thing that I want now is finally getting FREYA!

Glenn,
If I were you, I would certainly do all that you mentioned, cause as far as I see Freya just works better, you'll lose nothing with this mods.

Garry.

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05-31-2004 09:54 PM  13 years agoPost 23
sluggo

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Kitchener Ont

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I3DM there really is not much to it. Remove the links from your blade grips and the head button. Flip the grips over and reinstall your head button.

Then remove your seesaw arms ( I had them in the high mobility hole but put the in the standard hole instead of flipping the seesaw) and put them in on the other side of the seesaw. Reverse your pitch servo and recenter it if needed. When you have flipped everything then redo any mechanical setup as normal. It takes some getting used to seeing the swash moving up for - pitch and down for + pitch.

When you test fly the heli be prepared to turn your cyclic atv's way down from normal. I went from 100% to 60% and it is still very fast even with a slow setup. Also you may have to remove some pitch as well. Some of the links may need to be adjusted as well to make it all symmetrical.

So far some of the improvements I have seen are

Improved tracking of blades and heli
Quicker cyclics
way quicker pitch
Heli flies way faster

The heli just feels way better and more controllable which is amazing as in stock forum the X-spec is a sweet heli.

Chris

Teambob00

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05-31-2004 09:57 PM  13 years agoPost 24
I3DM

rrProfessor

Israel

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This slmost sounds too good to be true - 5 minutes of work to make an awesome heli even better ! i will try it.
thanks.

www.liorzahavi.com

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05-31-2004 10:00 PM  13 years agoPost 25
mrNoodles

rrProfessor

Borlänge, Sweden

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Chris
Are you using the CX dampers?

/Fredrik
'Hm now I just have to find out where to connect the GV1 sensor to the Jazz80 ESC.

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05-31-2004 10:02 PM  13 years agoPost 26
white chocolate

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Baltimore, Md.

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grip flip

Hey Chris dont you flip the washout too??

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05-31-2004 10:08 PM  13 years agoPost 27
sluggo

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Kitchener Ont

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No just the upper head stuff like the grips and seesaw arms. Yes I am using the new CX dampners that should be on the market very soon.

Chris

Teambob00

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05-31-2004 10:28 PM  13 years agoPost 28
I3DM

rrProfessor

Israel

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Im wondering how this mod is so simple and seems so effective but Hirobo didnt thingk about it on their own...

it really sounds too good to be true. i will test mine like this on the weekend, i should be checking this on the stock Freya 90 too soon.

www.liorzahavi.com

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05-31-2004 10:45 PM  13 years agoPost 29
sluggo

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Kitchener Ont

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I am sure they did, As stock forum you have - delta or no correcting delta which makes the heli more unstable which is better for 3D flying. With the grip flip you get + delta or correcting detla which makes the heli more stable.

I am sure that they did it that way to make the heli more appealing for 3D flying. This is just a guess though

Chris

Teambob00

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05-31-2004 10:48 PM  13 years agoPost 30
I3DM

rrProfessor

Israel

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Hmmm... but according to you Sluggo the heli is now more stable AND more agile (better for 3d) with faster cyclics and collective, No ?

www.liorzahavi.com

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05-31-2004 10:51 PM  13 years agoPost 31
sluggo

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Kitchener Ont

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Ya I know what ya mean, It is more stable but the cyclics are faster as well. Not sure why I haven't got that far into it yet. It is something you have to try to feel the differents.

Try it then tell us what ya think.

Chris

Teambob00

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05-31-2004 11:11 PM  13 years agoPost 32
Garry-Boy

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Moscow, Russia

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How could that be aggressive and at the same time more stable?
Im wondering how this mod is so simple and seems so
effective but Hirobo didnt thingk about it on their own...
That is exactly what I'm asking, It's very obvious but they didn't do that.
I tried to do the same thing when I got SZ-IV head on my Sceadu, but I got a CCPM mechanics and I was a bit confused with programming it.
Later I understood what should I do but it was too late I already got a SD-G Head.

Garry.

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05-31-2004 11:20 PM  13 years agoPost 33
sluggo

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Kitchener Ont

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A heli can be very stable but yet still be very aggressive. The heli flys more locked in but yet is still very quick for 3D. You are confusing aggressive with unstable. They are to different things, a unstable heli will be a hand full to fly (very pitchy and tippy feel in fff) where a stable heli flys almost hands off in fff.

Now a stable but yet aggressive heli will still have the quick snap but flys very true and straight and almost hands off.

I hope that is easier to understand.

Teambob00

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05-31-2004 11:40 PM  13 years agoPost 34
Helinutnz

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below 42 South

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You finding out?

Sluggo are you trying to find out from Hirobo why they chose to put the grips on the way they did? Is it just done by convention or are other heli's setup with the leading style of grip for the reasons you stated above? I am still just a little confused about it all. Why wouldn't they set up the heli like this from stock if you not only get more stability but faster cyclics and collective. I am all for it if that is the result but generally more stability results in a harder to move blade doesn't it?
Cheers
Glenn

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05-31-2004 11:45 PM  13 years agoPost 35
Garry-Boy

rrKey Veteran

Moscow, Russia

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Now a stable but yet aggressive heli
That's really sounds like a perfect helicopter don’t you think?


Garry.

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06-01-2004 04:33 AM  13 years agoPost 36
Royrex

rrApprentice

TN USA

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If the blade grip bearing play is more than the dampner movement, then you have destablizing delta. ? ?

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06-01-2004 05:25 AM  13 years agoPost 37
kym

rrApprentice

Provo Utah

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A heli can be very stable but yet still be very aggressive
This sound very cool? I want to kept track of this.

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06-01-2004 03:37 PM  13 years agoPost 38
MRC-Hirobo

rrKey Veteran

Edison, NJ

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If you want to keep your existing ratios and do the grip flip, all you need to do is pop off the arms keeping the rods together and attached to the mixing arm, remove the two seesaw attaching bolts, roll over the seesaw, reattach the seesaw and then reattach the arms.

If using the metal 0414228 mixing arms, you will need to adjust your linkage rods as the arms will be upside down now similar to shuttle mixing arms.

Cannot comment as to why the head was not originally designed that way, but maybe convention is the answer. You will notice that all the new heads, EVO, SSR7, are leading edge controlled.

As you have noticed and per Augusto, once you do this the servo direction on the pitch needs to be changed. Be careful to make sure your washout block stays in the pins and has a good amount of the pins in the block when pulled down. Flipping the block over is not really a good idea as the pins will now be too short. If using the longer balls on the inner ring of the swashplate for the upper mixing arms, there should be enough clearance between the rod and the screw head on the washout block arms. Just check between flights for any signs of rubbing between the two and correct as you see fit.

I would like to hear how others make out with this mod and so will Hirobo. They too check this forum pretty regulary.

Thanks

jeff

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06-01-2004 06:04 PM  13 years agoPost 39
Garry-Boy

rrKey Veteran

Moscow, Russia

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To R&D team who might looking through this forum now!

1.You could use a plus delta on the blade holders with your new Freya Twister. In this case it will finally beat X-spec, cause CCPM mechanics to my mind is really doubt advantage of buying Twister instead of standart.
2. Still I can’t understand why you didn’t put the blade holders to the positive delta from the very beginning, maybe if you did this, than far more guys would buy Freya instead of Fury.

Garry.

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06-01-2004 06:08 PM  13 years agoPost 40
Garry-Boy

rrKey Veteran

Moscow, Russia

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For one who got CCMP version on the Freya.

After you did this mode, all you need to do with your radio is just switching a mark of plus/negative, in front of the percent of pitch travel, to the opposite one, in your swash travel-adjusting menu.
For example on my 9Z it’s a SWH function in the Model menu. Just go there and change the mark in front of the pitch to the opposite for example from –50% to +50%. Here we go nothing else, besides the curves

Garry.

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HelicopterHIROBOOther › Helping stabilize unstable blades in the Freya
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