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ProModeler Scorpion Power
andre

Senior Heliman

France

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Hi all
I have a Turbine starwod lama flying very nice
Rotor is very smooth and tracking OK
But in some flying atitudes the rotor is showing blades out of tracking and coming back OK after a while without tracking !
I thought with grease on the O rings it would cure the problem ....
Still having some issues
My question : Do you think I should try harder of softer O rings if I can find some ?
Thanks for advice
Regards
Andre

07-06-2016 04:15 PM
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don s

Key Veteran

Chesapeake, VA

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New thrust bearings maybe?

E820, Raptor G4N, X50F/E, E620, Forza 450, and some planks.

07-06-2016 04:17 PM
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andre

Senior Heliman

France

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Thanks for info , I greased them too and they seemed to be smooth ....
I will check them again .
Andre

07-06-2016 04:23 PM
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R.J.

Veteran

SF bay area, CA USA

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Maybe double check the thrust races are installed in the correct orientation?

07-06-2016 08:40 PM
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WIRLYBIRD

Veteran

CAPE TOWN / SOUTH AFRICA.

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Blade Tracking

If all else is good maybe one more blades are bad!!

WHAT GOES UP MUST SURELY COME DOWN.

07-06-2016 09:19 PM
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andre

Senior Heliman

France

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Hi
Thanks for informations .
I spoke today with someone that cured the problem by taking off the O rings and puting a steal sleeve instead for blocking the head !!
This option comes from Vario meeting ......
In his other helis more than 2m rotor he has other vario heads blocked which work well too
I am thinking about this idea but I am a little worring ....
This idea must be good for flybarless module .
Regards
Andre

07-07-2016 05:22 AM
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PETER ROB

Elite Veteran

Devon UK

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Andre,did you check that all the blade securing bolts were tightened up evenly?
Peter R

07-07-2016 08:11 AM
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andre

Senior Heliman

France

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Hi
Excuse my poor English : what do you mean by evenly ? strongly ?
I tighten not strong , not loose , blades moving with hand softly not hardly ....
What do you think about the sleeve ?
Thanks
Andre

07-07-2016 08:55 AM
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PETER ROB

Elite Veteran

Devon UK

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Andre, s'egaliser, all the same tightness,(tension)
You will find rubber rings in most model helicopter blade grips/heads,
They dampen shock loads, replace them with some thing rigid and the shock has to go some where else
For me it is not a good idea

In a 2 blade head, if the spindle between the 2 blade grips is bent even very slightly, some times, the blades track ok, other times they are out of track, this is because the spindle can rotate, turn, when flying

with a multi blade head, put a different coloured tape on each blade tip to see if it is the same blade each time that is out of track

A longer method is to put a piece of coloured tape on one blade at a time, fly, check, then change the tape to another blade

Do you always place the same blade in the same holder?, a drop of paint/nail varnish(your chose of colour), on the blade and blade grip, will make sure they are always in the same position for every flight

Start by marking the blades, check all the bolts are the same, track the blades, and see if it happens again
Peter R
Where in France do you fly?

07-07-2016 10:42 AM
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andre

Senior Heliman

France

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Thanks Peter for the time you spent writing ....
I fly around Paris mainly in Lognes and Bellefontaine
If you come here , it will be a pleasure to meet you !
Let me know.
Best regards
Andre

07-07-2016 12:16 PM
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andre

Senior Heliman

France

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I forgot to say that I replaced the original blades with Helitec ones
Very nice blades much lighter , some 320 gr instead of 450 gr ....
And tracking is much better with them and less problems
Regards
Andre

07-07-2016 12:23 PM
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Phoenix NOTAR

Senior Heliman

State College, PA USA

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Andre,

It seems you may have solved your issue, but I will respond to some of your questions anyway.

I have been flying the Starwood Lama since 2013, and I have over 45 hours of flying time on the turbine.

I run harder O-rings in the head for blade flapping, not softer, 5 in each blade arm. I also revised the bushings in the flapping pivot so they had very minimal "slop" or free play.

I have seen Vario fly their Lama with the Starwood head and steel sleeves replacing the O-rings, BUT, they were also using fiberglass rotor blades and not carbon fiber blades. So there was some "damping" in the head system via the more flexible rotor blades. I would use extreme caution with the steel sleeves and still rotor blades.

I have not had any blade tracking issues (I use the stock Starwood rotor blades), but I did have a "wobble" of the entire helicopter in hover and slow flight. I completely cured this phenomenon by very carefully and accurately adjusting the blade bolt tightness every time I install the main rotor blades. I use a digital "fish weighing" scale, and pull the blades near the root until I get the same reading on each blade. I pull with a measured force of approximately 2kg on each blade with the blade level, and I pull at the "M" in "SWM" embossed on the blades. This has the blades a bit loose in the grips compared to my other helicopters, and all three are very uniform to each other.

If I do not use this technique to tighten the blades my helicopter will "wobble". If I spend the time and perform this task accurately my helicopter flies perfectly every time.

I believe the reason for these issues with this head is due to how far out the blade bolt (pivot) is relative to the center of the mainshaft. Much longer than almost any other rotor head.

I hope this information is of some help to you or others.

Sandy

07-07-2016 12:50 PM
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andre

Senior Heliman

France

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Hi Sandy
Thanks for information , very useful ....
I don't like the original blades at all , to heavy , poor finition compared to the helitec I bought . The helicopter is much more smooth with them.Lighter blades improve behaviour ..
And they are much less expensive !
Now you confirm what I thought I will change the O rings for harder ones , I just have to find the reference ! If you know tell me .
I agree with you concerning the bushings : too much play in there.
Now concerning fixation of the blades I tought that coming to full power at 0 degre pitch and waiting for the rotor to stop and fix the blades in their position was a good option .....Perhaps I don't fix them enough hard .
I will try harder next time . I generaly let them turn with medium force by hand .
Best regards
Andre

07-07-2016 02:47 PM
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andre

Senior Heliman

France

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07-07-2016 02:49 PM
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Phoenix NOTAR

Senior Heliman

State College, PA USA

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Andre,

I do not have the specification for the O-rings I installed, sorry.

I think that you should re-fit the original blades, and preform a test flight with the blades quite loose in the grips, as I have described. Definitely DO NOT re-tighten them after a spool-up. See if the tracking issue is still there.

Everyone has their own interpretation of what is a good or bad feel for how a RC helicopter performs in flight. Joel's helicopters fly magnificently, but when I fly his helicopters they "feel" terrible to me, much too sensitive. When I watch Peter Wales fly his helicopters in a wonderfully smooth and elegant flight, I watch him move the transmitter sticks almost full throw for a gentle "scale like" turn. I need much more stick control/sensitivity that that! So everybody has their own likes and dislikes of how a helicopter should "feel".

Here is an old video of a flight with my Lama from 2013:

Watch at YouTube

I just do not want other Starwood Lama owners to think that the stock blades are not able to be used on this helicopter. Maybe there is an issue with your set of blades (tracking). But with a slightly stiffer head and "properly" tightened blades, I can say that mine flies very well in a "scale like" manner.

Regards,

Sandy

07-07-2016 04:18 PM
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andre

Senior Heliman

France

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Hi here is a vidéo of mine with original blades
Flies well too but flies better with my new blades .....

Watch at YouTube

07-07-2016 05:26 PM
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