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rcnut

Elite Veteran

Rockford, Illinois

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Ok campers! I think I've bugged Carey enough with this Agile conversion that he finally has a kit (almost complete) to send to me. My conversion kit is in the mail and on its way! My kit doesn't come with instructions or a start shaft, as they are not ready yet, but this is ok...

My kit is coming with the generator plate and 3 stand-offs (Raja can relax about the support strength of the generator motor)...so when the start shaft is finished being heat treated, I'll drop the motor and install that along with Raja's generator system. I'm not sure if this generator mount plate is included with the kit or an option. I'll have to ask Carey.

Carey was nice enough to pre-assemble the kit with no Loctite. Synergy does the same thing with their kits, so nothing unusual there. I'm sure he did this for me as there are no instructions ready at this time.

I have everything I need...donor motor & muffler from my first Goblin gasser, servos on the Agile, purchased a new Spartan Vortex VX1n, a new rpm pick up vs. the Stator Gator, a micro throttle servo, the upgrade wide belt & pulley, and the Agile itself. Oh, and Raja's generator system which I'll add at a later time.

Carey mentioned I have a choice of where I would like to have the FBL controller mounted...the top rear area next to the main shaft, just above the boom, or the front...below and behind the battery tray, hidden. I will leave it at the top rear. I like to have access to the controller for programming/update purposes. I will also route the power wire to the rear. So the only time I should need to remove the canopy is to check on the LiPo capacity.

I can't wait to see what this heli will feel like in the air! If the "mail" doesn't mess up, I should have the very first kit (well second as Carey has the first for build videos, etc.) as soon as Friday...or Saturday. The only dilemma here is, I have taken Friday & Tuesday off...due to the holiday weekend (4th of July on Monday), and the nice weather we will have in the Midwest. Sunny, 0-10 mph winds, very low humidity, and the temp...78-80 degrees!

So the urge to get out and spend a good portion of the day (Friday and/or Saturday) will be in conflict with the new build. However, I could do both! Fly part of the day, and then build...or build all day, and then fly, fly, fly... Whichever happens, it's going to be a fun 5 days!

I will take plenty of pics and post as often as I can to keep you guys up to date. And if I can talk Mark into shooting some videos for me, I'll try to post them as well.

Also, if all goes well, meaning I don't crash it badly, I'll have my Agile gasser at IRCHA. And I will be more than happy to fly a demo for you! And if Carey wants me to bring it for his Gasser Seminar (on Friday), it will be there on display.

So stay tuned! Oh I'm so stoked right now!!!

Team Miniature Aircraft
"I love the smell of Nitro in the morning!"
...Citizen 654!

06-30-2016 11:16 AM
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rcnut

Elite Veteran

Rockford, Illinois

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My kit finally arrived! However, I had to track down my mailman to get it! I started yesterday by removing the motor and muffler from my Goblin, and then removing the clutch shoe and motor mount...a good time to clean and inspect everything.

I had heard the mail truck drive by and ran to the window to see, but he had passed. So I knew Friday could be the day. Shortly after that, he came by again and stopped at my mailbox. After a few minutes of sitting there, he got out and had a big box under his arm! Whoot! It's here! As he was walking up the side walk, he stopped and looked intensely at the porch. What? What's he doing??? Of course I'm not dressed to answer the door, stupid me. My mailman turns around and heads back to his truck!

I ran upstairs to get dressed properly, a whole 30 seconds, just in time to see him drive away! NO! I rush out to the garage and jump into my truck. As I'm pulling out, I look to the front porch to see what he might have been looking at, and low and behold...there was a big possum sitting right in front of my door!

So I go after the mailman and caught him half way down the next block. I think he was waiting for me! He knew me and said I have a package for you, but didn't want to confront the possum, considering it was out in daylight.

So back home to start the build!

More later, as I'm getting ready to meet Mark for breakfast and do some flying today! But I wanted to give you guys an update that it arrived!

It looks great and I'm almost done with the transformation.

Team Miniature Aircraft
"I love the smell of Nitro in the morning!"
...Citizen 654!

07-02-2016 01:49 PM
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Rojoalfa

Senior Heliman

Punta de Mata, Monagas-Venezuela

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/
/

Pics please...

/

Saludos cordiales,

07-02-2016 11:58 PM
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rcnut

Elite Veteran

Rockford, Illinois

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You want pics!!! Ok, here we go!

Here is the box I received from Carey. And in it is the semi assembled kit. Now like I have stated, this kit was assembled by Carey due to no instructions. I am on my own to figure out how to build this heli...with some help from Carey. All other kits will have instructions on how to assemble this heli. Some of the step may come from what I had to do, but then again... So this is the process I am going through...

First order...strip down my Agile. Down to just the frames and center section. Before I started the tear-down, I weighed my Agile with the LiPo's...13.5 lb.. I will see what the finish weight will be after the conversion.
Looks like I'm going to need most of it, except for the two frame sides, the center section for scraping the LiPos to, and the bottom plate.

Here is some photos of the front clutch stack, before & after disassemble it. The red anodized parts look great matching almost perfectly to the Agile kit. And with the "red" MKS servos and "red" VX1n controller, this heli is going to look cool trimmed in red! Wait until you see it with the canopy on!

This is the difference between the normal belt and wide belt and pulley. These are upgrade parts of the Version 2 electric Agile heli. This came about because of other pilots having issues of stripping and breaking the belt. I haven't hear of any problems with the new belt size...so far!

Carey had installed the washers on the top and bottom of the pulley, so I decided to try that setup to see if the belt will ride in the middle, versus the top or bottom of the pulley. Then I did a trial fit to see how this is going to look and where the top plate and bottom bearing block is going to fit.

I had to disassemble the clutch stack and assemble the top plate to the clutch stack first. Then insert the new wide gear with the main gear pinion into the belt. It's a tight fit, but doable. Then, and while I had this subassembly out of the frames, I installed the main gear and the bottom bearing block plate. And now it can be fitted to the frame. The bottom bearing block had a shouldered step(?) that fits into the frame. This helps with the alignment of this assembly and making sure the frame is straight.

Now that the "heart" of this heli is done...I used the two short frame pieces, or frame stiffeners, to help stiffen the front of the frame (an alternate receiver/controller mount) and the one next to the clutch stack is the pinion/belt guard. Then I installed the battery plate.

I added two of the actual metal frame spacers to the front, just above the landing gear, and read below the fuel tank. To help stiffen the frame. The frame is really stiff now without the motor and landing gear.

Now it was time to clean up and checkout the motor. I bought this motor from Carey when I built my first Goblin gasser. It is the TRM275tt Special Edition. This is the motor that Carey added a red anodized top and the carb stack. I installed the motor mount,and the same clutch shoe (after I cleaned it up some) from the Gobby (as the inner diameter is the same as the Goblin clutch bell), the OWB, and the bottom motor plate. This motor has 72 flights on it when I pulled it out of my Gobby, so it's broken in and ready to rock and roll!

And now the motor is ready to be installed! The Goblin kit come with a heat scoop for the hot air coming off the motor. I had to remove this scoop and make a carbon fiber plate instead. The scoop is too tall and hits the frame, well, it's in the way and the motor won't fit with it. With the motor installed, this plate just barely touches the frame.

So there you have it! 7 hours of work and possibly another 7-8 to finish. After Mark and finished flying today, I forgot to stop off at the hobby shop to pick up a couple of things, male EC3 connector, and some more tygon fuel tubing...and maybe another DSMX receiver. I went down to my workshop to do some more building, but just didn't have the energy, so here I am posting pics and my thoughts.

Things I have left to do...

Finish the wiring and start programming the VX1n and radio.

Plume the fuel tank and motor.

Mount the canopy...this should be interesting considering I'm using RCBooya mounts for the front. The kit has a motor strap that incorporates a counter sunk screw to hold the canopy mount. So I will need to figure out how I'm going to set this up...I have a couple of ideas...

And then maiden time! I'm hoping I am able to test fly this Monday/Tuesday. And maybe I can get someone to video record for me, otherwise I'll have to wait for Mark next weekend.

Oh yea...Raja, you will get sloppy seconds! LoL! Mark is chomping at the bit to fly my Agile! And he has already priced out the kit and conversion. I'm waiting for him to send me a text stating he pushed the button!

Team Miniature Aircraft
"I love the smell of Nitro in the morning!"
...Citizen 654!

07-03-2016 01:31 AM
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rbort

rrProfessor

Franklin, MA - USA

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2nds, 3rds, I'm ready!

Don't forget you need a one way hub with the bearing flipped or flip that one once you get the start shaft kit in there for the Jewel.

She's looking good so far, let me know the all up weight variance from 13.5 electric.

-=>Raja.

MA 1005 Hanson 280, 4038 flights
Raptor 90 Hanson 300, 267 flights
Spectra-G G270 3DMax, 3109 flights
Whiplash-G G270 3DMax, 1270 flights

07-03-2016 02:31 AM
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ttaylor63

Senior Heliman

Floresville,Tx

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How long till others can order the conversion. My Agile wants to be a gasser also...

07-03-2016 05:57 AM
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rcnut

Elite Veteran

Rockford, Illinois

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Raja...already ahead of you! The OWB in the hub has been flipped.

Team Miniature Aircraft
"I love the smell of Nitro in the morning!"
...Citizen 654!

07-03-2016 12:12 PM
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rcnut

Elite Veteran

Rockford, Illinois

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Day two

I routed the 12 gauge power wires, throttle servo, and front SMDX sat to the rear in a wire wrap.

The front canopy mount is part of the motor mount to frame. The center hole is off center. The off center hole is towards the front.

I should have known better than to finish the wiring before testing it, but when it came time to program the throttle servo, it didn't work, or so I thought! I removed the sleeving to trouble shoot the possibility of the extension was bad or not connected. Come to find out, I had picked the wrong frequency setting in the Spartan Vortex controller...oops!

Now that most of the programming is done and everything is working, on to laying out the RPM sensor.

Because the Spartan Vortex has a built-in governor, I used the Aerospire RPM Sensor. I glued the sensor with "Goop" to the side of the motor case, and I used the computer link for the Vortex controller to sense the flywheel magnet. It basically has a box that lights up when the sensor detects a magnet.

So now that the sensor and DSMX rear sat is installed and tied down, I installed the tail assembly and muffler. You will notice the boom supports are mounted behind the fuel tank...more on the in a moment.

The electric version of the Agile, the boom supports mount to the landing gear mount. However, the fuel tank is in the way, so I had to move the boom clamp back several inches. It looks different, but it works.

Here is the fuel tank installed and plumbed. I managed to stuff the 3 - 2-1/2" loops inside the frame just above the tank. I thought I had a 90 degree fuel line connector, but I didn't, so I used what Carey provided in the kit. I drilled the cap versus going to the side of the tank, which might work just as well... I also mounted the temp gauge above the tank for easy view, plus I'm used to seeing it there!

I moved the LiPo pack (Pulse 2 cell, 5000mAh) to the bottom as I was having issues with the canopy not fitting correctly. Yea, it was my fault again, I had turned the front canopy mounts around which pulled the canopy too far back and it was hitting the power wire EC3 connector. Now that that was fixed, and being in a hurry to test fly this heli...I think I can return the LiPo back to the front tray where I had it.

More pic's of the 3 loops stuffed inside the frame.

The canopy on and it fits! I had to make a couple of relief cuts in the canopy to clear the muffler and fuel tubing.

Out for the maiden flight!!!

Team Miniature Aircraft
"I love the smell of Nitro in the morning!"
...Citizen 654!

07-05-2016 03:08 PM
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rrProfessor

Franklin, MA - USA

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Fuel

How big is that fuel tank? Is that an 8 or 16oz?

What's the total weight dry RTF?

-=>Raja.

MA 1005 Hanson 280, 4038 flights
Raptor 90 Hanson 300, 267 flights
Spectra-G G270 3DMax, 3109 flights
Whiplash-G G270 3DMax, 1270 flights

07-05-2016 03:31 PM
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rcnut

Elite Veteran

Rockford, Illinois

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The maiden flight!

So now its time for the maiden flight! I filled the tank and ran through one final check. Everything is ok! The weather could have been better...overcast, a bit humid, a light breeze, and warm.

I set the throttle trim and primed the carb. 3 pulls on the motor and it came to life. This motor has 72 flights on it, so I don't have to break it in, just tune it to this heli. I took it out and set it down, and now it was time to see if it was flight worthy. I advanced the throttle and checked the tail response as it was spooling up, then checked the cyclic response...everything is ok.

I added more throttle and off the ground it came! My Agile gasser is airborne! The tail gain is a bit too sensitive, but manageable. I pirouetted to the right and left checking the tail response...need to increase that more. I pointed the nose to my right and proceeded with forward flight.

So far the controls are a bit sluggish for me, it is better suited for beginner to intermediate pilots. But this will work for wringing it out. The tail is very crisp and authoritative. It flies through the air as if it is on rails! It is very solid and precise.

I switched into idle up 1, and I was expecting the tail to get out of control, but it didn't...much. I started in with a few basic aerobatics...loops, rolls, stall turns, and quickly went into my advance maneuvers! Flips, tic-toc's, traveling flips, inverted funnels...

This Agile performed everything well! About the only thing I didn't like was the fast autos. It bleeds off lift at the end...very fast! It is because of the blades! I am (and not for long!) using the KDS blades, and I believe those are 690's, or something like that. They are not very stiff and could explain the bit of sluggishness I was feeling...and the fast autos.

The finish weight of my Agile, before fuel, is 14 pounds... Yea, it's on the heavy side, but is flies a bit better than the Whiplash gasser, and almost like my N7, only slower...for now! LoL!

I do have some tuning up to do to see how this heli will really perform. So stay tuned! This weekend it coming up and I have a lot of flying to do with this heli!

Oh yea...12.5 minutes for the first flight!

Team Miniature Aircraft
"I love the smell of Nitro in the morning!"
...Citizen 654!

07-05-2016 03:34 PM
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rcnut

Elite Veteran

Rockford, Illinois

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Raja, not sure how big the tank is, but I think it is around the 16 oz. mark. Would need to ask Carey!

Team Miniature Aircraft
"I love the smell of Nitro in the morning!"
...Citizen 654!

07-05-2016 03:36 PM
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rcnut

Elite Veteran

Rockford, Illinois

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Here are a few pic's I snapped just before the maiden flight;

It took a total of 12 hours to convert my electric Agile to gas.

Team Miniature Aircraft
"I love the smell of Nitro in the morning!"
...Citizen 654!

07-05-2016 03:39 PM
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rrProfessor

Franklin, MA - USA

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12.5 minutes

Maybe its something in between, like a 12oz?

Do you have a hand crank pump? You can fill the tank and count the cranks going around, then empty it.

Then go fill another know tank say your whiplash tank and count the cranks. We know that one is 15 oz. See how it compares.

14 lbs that's like my Raptor (but I have a generator included), the heaviest in my fleet it still flies good but I would have liked it to be lighter. This Whiplash can be as light as 12lbs without a generator

You can try the Rail 716 blades, they auto one of the best as they are longer and a little bit heavier to hold their rpms at the end. That will add a little bit more weight, maybe 2oz, but the heli will feel better.

What headspeed are you running with it now? OH, also make the starter removable, you will save 3.5oz almost the weight of a generator down the road.

-=>Raja.

MA 1005 Hanson 280, 4038 flights
Raptor 90 Hanson 300, 267 flights
Spectra-G G270 3DMax, 3109 flights
Whiplash-G G270 3DMax, 1270 flights

07-05-2016 03:43 PM
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rcnut

Elite Veteran

Rockford, Illinois

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I have an electric pump, sorry, no hand crank. Weight wise, it matches that of the Goblin. I was hoping it would have been lighter than the Goblin.

I have a set of 716 Rails that I am intending to use next! I have the head speed set to 1950 and 2050. I might drop the 1950 to 1900 as there is not much difference between the two head speeds for now, but that could be due to the motor tuning...rich. I haven't flown this motor in some time.

Team Miniature Aircraft
"I love the smell of Nitro in the morning!"
...Citizen 654!

07-05-2016 03:49 PM
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rrProfessor

Franklin, MA - USA

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Yeah

Try the 716's for sure and drop the rpms down some, what's the gear ratio on this? By the way it looks very nice and elegant!

-=>Raja.

MA 1005 Hanson 280, 4038 flights
Raptor 90 Hanson 300, 267 flights
Spectra-G G270 3DMax, 3109 flights
Whiplash-G G270 3DMax, 1270 flights

07-05-2016 03:51 PM
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rcnut

Elite Veteran

Rockford, Illinois

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Thanks Raja, I forgot to mention that! The gear ratio is 7.128:1 (or 7.13:1). I set the controller for 7.13:1

Team Miniature Aircraft
"I love the smell of Nitro in the morning!"
...Citizen 654!

07-05-2016 03:53 PM
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rrProfessor

Franklin, MA - USA

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Ok that's high

So in that case I would think I'd want to run it somewhere not much more than 1850 head speed. Try it with 716's at 1800 and 1850 and see how it feels and flies. Ideally 1800 would be in the torque range, 1850 would be past it.

I'm trying to find Joey's original post about it, he may have mentioned the size of the gas tank there.

-=>Raja.

MA 1005 Hanson 280, 4038 flights
Raptor 90 Hanson 300, 267 flights
Spectra-G G270 3DMax, 3109 flights
Whiplash-G G270 3DMax, 1270 flights

07-05-2016 03:57 PM
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rrProfessor

Franklin, MA - USA

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Ok found it

It is a 16oz nalgene bottle, so if only 12.5 minutes until it ran out I would venture to guess you might still be a little rich. In any case when you slow down the head some you'll also get more airtime. With the 275 I would expect you should be able to get at least 15 minutes on 16oz.

-=>Raja.

MA 1005 Hanson 280, 4038 flights
Raptor 90 Hanson 300, 267 flights
Spectra-G G270 3DMax, 3109 flights
Whiplash-G G270 3DMax, 1270 flights

07-05-2016 04:24 PM
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rcnut

Elite Veteran

Rockford, Illinois

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I'm not sure about this, but I thing Carey might have mentioned making a couple of different gear ratios.

Team Miniature Aircraft
"I love the smell of Nitro in the morning!"
...Citizen 654!

07-05-2016 04:33 PM
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rrProfessor

Franklin, MA - USA

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I'm sure he'll chime in, he's here now

If possible Carey/Ray, a little lower gear ratio would be better. My Spectra is 7.15 but I prefer the 6.75-6.9 range better. You can get more head speed and not turn up the motor as much that way.

I would guess that right now its not available Carey is just starting to make the first version of the conversion. If/when they sell and the demand goes up I'm sure it will be no problem to make other GR requests.

-=>Raja.

MA 1005 Hanson 280, 4038 flights
Raptor 90 Hanson 300, 267 flights
Spectra-G G270 3DMax, 3109 flights
Whiplash-G G270 3DMax, 1270 flights

07-05-2016 04:54 PM
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