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Flybarless vs. Flybar

Kujo66

Heliman

Toledo, Ohio

Ive been flying my MCPX now for awhile but eventually am planning on getting bigger. Should I stick to flybarless or go to flybar?

10-06-2011 Over year old.
BrainDrain_dx

Key Veteran

Wichita KS

flybar is dead. Flybarless all the way

KDS Agile 7.2/5.5 Chase 360 - SkyHero Spyder/Spy/Little Spyder
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10-06-2011 Over year old.
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mustang67ford

Key Veteran

Central Pennsylvania

I would go with a flybar for 3 reasons. The first being the cost; the gyro required for a flybarless heli is about x3 the cost of a regular gyro. Think of that from a crash standpoint especally if learning. Secondly, I always prefer to learn how things originate. If you never try a flybar, how could you explain to somebody else or help them set it up? Learn the history first I say. Lastly, you can change flybar paddles to further tune the heli.

I am saying all this without owning a heli without a flybar. I'm sure others will chime in with the benefits.

Team HeliProz
AMA #513507
IRCHA #4011

10-06-2011 Over year old.
Gamb

Senior Heliman

Belle Mead, NJ USA

mustang67ford, I think you are missing a "not" in your post.

There are a lot of posts on fly-bar vs. flybarless, here is one of them:

http://rc.runryder.com/helicopter/t664958p1/

I would have to agree that the future is flybarless, but I don't think it is a good idea to start out with. The Blade MCPx, which can be flown right out off the box is a rare exception. The bigger heli's come as kits, and it would be quite an effort to build and set it up, if you have no prior build experience.

As Mustnag67ford mentioned, the flybarless system itself is quite an expensive investment, especially if you are just getting into the hobby. They are also very complex to set up just right. Prior experience with flybar heli's do help, but not by much. So, gettting it just right, to be able to fly it will take a lot more effort, unless you have expert help. The flying "feel" is also very different, but something one would get used to.

Flybarless have less components on the head so "should be" cheaper to fix after a crash, but only time will tell. I don't know how robust the actual flybarless system would be in a crash, but with the state of electronics today, it should not be an issue.

You may want to pick up a used Blade 400 from the classifieds and then see if you want to make the jump to a bigger flybarless heli. If you don't mind the expense, the Balde 450 is another good choice. These are set up for you from the factory for basic flying.

Do invest in a good radio, so that you can maximize your enjoyment of the hobby.

10-06-2011 Over year old.
CX1

Key Veteran

Canada

Ive been flying my MCPX now for awhile but eventually am planning on getting bigger. Should I stick to flybarless or go to flybar?
it depends on the individuals ability to read and follow instructions.
as well as the persons budget.

flybarred or FBL which is better?
in my books they are basicaly equal in difficulty as far as set-up and tuning is concerned.
the only advantage for FBL is you get more power to the main blades

" Team Protoast "

10-06-2011 Over year old.
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Kujo66

Heliman

Toledo, Ohio

flybarless....

With cost and set-up difficulty of flybarless aside how much more or less difficult is it to fly a flybar heli vs. flybarless? I have DX8 for my mcpx and I hope to get possibly an Align over the winter. Either a 550 or 600. I just didnt know after flying my mcpx how much trouble I would be in, if any, if I went back to a flybar heli.

10-07-2011 Over year old.
wifeorheli

Elite Veteran

reno, nevada usa

And yet another FB vs. FBL thread
Ding.. Ding.. Goes the bell

Go fbl I will never get a fb heli again nothing against it but i like the feel and the noticable more power and also simplicity and faster rebuild and lower parts count. Setup is not as hard as everyone keeps saying it is. Need i say more

Team CookeVilleHobby.com
http://www.TeamRcHeliWorks.com
Novarossi Motors-Pulse Lipos-Halo

10-07-2011 Over year old.
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BarracudaHockey

rrMaster

Jacksonville FL

Neither is "harder" or "easier" to fly. They are a bit different but keep in mind, the idea behind an FBL controller is to replicate what the flybar does (impart gyroscopic stability) without the complexity of parts. It also lets you tune the system from beginner to spanking, without changing parts (flybar weights and paddles) or tinkering with the mechanics (mixing arm holes, flybar ratios), stuff you can do on a laptop interface now.

As for cost, how much do you save by not buying a dedicated tail gyro? Even a 401 is a hundred bucks, and a Beast or 3G is how much?

Edited to add:

A 520 gyro costs 150
A 750 is 300 and includes a 3 axis gyro AND a governor (another 100ish?)
So what does it really cost in the end?

Andy
AMA 77227
http://www.jaxrc.com

10-07-2011 Over year old.
gologo

Veteran

Sedalia, Mo USA

[quote]As for cost, how much do you save by not buying a dedicated tail gyro? Even a 401 is a hundred bucks, and a Beast or 3G is how much?[quote]


And don't forget to knock off another 60-70 or more bucks for a reciever, for some FBL units. Flying a $300 V-bar, you can subtract
back off close to $200 for the gyro/Rx, that you will be taking off.
( or never be putting on in the first place)

10-08-2011 Over year old.
Gamb

Senior Heliman

Belle Mead, NJ USA

Good responses! The price difference is not that great if you factor in the gyro and receiver you DON'T need. I think if FBL systems start going for $250.00 or less (which should not be too long from now given the increasing number of systems being introduced and Moore's Law) there won't be much of an argument for flybar heli's. I think once it reaches that price point, flybars will only be seen on the cheapest heli's.

I'm seriously considering a FBL system for my next heli. May have to upgrade the radio to reap all the benefits of FBL though. So you may have to factor that into the cost.

10-08-2011 Over year old.
Ronald Thomas

rrMaster

Gainesville, Fl, USA

I'm seriously considering a FBL system for my next heli. May have to upgrade the radio to reap all the benefits of FBL though. So you may have to factor that into the cost.
That is only for some systems, not most as a matter a fact.
FBL is an awesome thing and as long as you have help if you get stuck(you will need it with setting up a flybar heli also) you can conquer it very easily.
Mr Mel is a WEALTH of knowledge for the Mikado VBAR system. The newest version (5.2) literally walks you through the set up explaining what each thing does and how changes affect the heli. Then if all else fails, MR Mel made videos that have step by step instructions....it can't get any easier
I say go FBL, the heli will fly better, be more stable, and have less parts to replace if you crash. Good luck................Ron

Team MikadoUSA 480XXTreme, 550SX, 600SX, 700XXTreme, 800XXTreme!!

10-08-2011 Over year old.
steffgiguere

rrProfessor

St-Eustache, Quebec, Canada

If you have never flown FB before then FBL is not harder. You just need to get used to it as you need to get used to FB.
Yes gyro is more expensive, but rarely does the gyro break in a crash. Less parts therefore less expensive to fix if you crash. Then once rebuilt with FBL the heli feels exactly as it did before you crashed, which is not always the case with a FB heli.
I say go FBL it's the future anyway.

Team Synergy, Canada: Team Scorpion

10-08-2011 Over year old.
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Kujo66

Heliman

Toledo, Ohio

FBL...

Ok, thanks steffgiguere..Im convinced now. I guess thats what I was asking all along but I guess I was not really understood. I know there are all kinds of threads on this topic but this was easier so oh well. The mcpx has been all I have flown so I was not certain if I should stick with FBL or if FB was easier.

10-08-2011 Over year old.
Gamb

Senior Heliman

Belle Mead, NJ USA

Have to agree that if you have experience with neither, and you can afford the extra expense of a Flybarless system, go for it. You won't have to re-learn anything. FBL does not make it any easier to learn to fly a heli. It does not fly the heli by itself. It just responds differently to your transmitter input so you get a different "feel".

10-08-2011 Over year old.
Kujo66

Heliman

Toledo, Ohio

fbl...

I have flown both on my sim and I did notice somewhat of a quicker response I believe. Im gonna be playing around on my mcpx till winter and most likely be making a purchase for bigger then. Thanks for all the input.

10-08-2011 Over year old.
steffgiguere

rrProfessor

St-Eustache, Quebec, Canada

Quicker or slower response it's all programmable.

Team Synergy, Canada: Team Scorpion

10-08-2011 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
jester4

Key Veteran

Brampton, Ontario

I thInk setup is much easier with fbl heli's for sure. I just switched over this past weekend from a fb outrage 90 on Wednesday to fbl on Saturday so I got a chance to fly the same heli within days and it flew about the same when just hovering around and circuits, but you could really tell the difference between the two (for me anyways) when you start throwing it around.

I found setting up much easier with the fbl because you didnt have to mess with the flybar links and washout trying to get everything perfect. Level swash and grips at mid stick and you're pretty much done.

10-12-2011 Over year old.
Zaneman007

Elite Veteran

Texas - USA

I started with flybar and the hardest part was setting up the gyro for the tail.

If you do not understand what the settings in the software mean or do, you will find it very frustrating. Although some people have had good luck otherwise, FBL unit is not plug and play.

Problem is some units require minimal set up to initialize the unit.

If the tail gyro on a FB heli turns the wrong way, it is not catistrofic, but insert that same error in your cyclic and it's $$$$$$.

But good friends can help you through all of that.

Personally, I prefer the FBL

Old Guys Rule!

10-13-2011 Over year old.
MicroVan

Senior Heliman

Virginia Beach, VA

I'd go with a 500 or 600 FBL setup!

If I knew what I know now back when I was flying the walkera lama I would hav skipped the 400 or 450's and gone with the 500 and up!

Yes it costs more but it also flies a lot more steady...

The cost with the FBL setup is about the same as getting your own gyro. How much was the Futaba gy601 and the gy611 coated when it hit the market? You can pick up a beastX or align's 3G/X for about the same.

Again, if I knew what I know now I'd go with a 500 and up heli!

I love this hobby!

10-13-2011 Over year old.
Flying Foot Doc

Senior Heliman

Plm Bch Grdns, Fl USA

I have both. To me it is a little like learning to drive on a stick shift or automatic. Since radial tubless tires and automatic transmissions have come out not many learn to drive with a stick or how to fix a flat with an innertube. I'm glad I know how, but I don't think it is necessary. Good luck, go fly! Andy

Inverted IS more fun!

11-02-2011 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
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