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ReadyHeli . Power Helis . CANOMOD

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Crashed? Discussion and Photos > Raptor 50 V2.. waas perfect, now totaled
 
 
AcesAreWld
Senior Heliman
Location: NJ Shore

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		More pics of destruction

for your viewing pleasure.. and my heartbreak



















--Geoff
08-29-2003 Over year old.
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AcesAreWld
Senior Heliman
Location: NJ Shore

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Hey, here is my own personal shopping list.. to show what I need to get.. give ya an idea how bad / not too too bad it was.

Parts Needed after helicopter crash:

Destroyed:

Radio:
1.) New Servos -- not massive $! Prefer JR or HiTec
2.) New RX -- HiTec Supreme 8 Chan FM Made for JR Radios
3.) Dean's black whip antenna
4.) new JR High Quality Heli Switch

Helicopter:
5.) Main Frame (PV0362)
6.) Servo Frame (PV0033)
7.) Tail Support braces (PV0329)
8.) White autorotation hub (PV0379)
9.) all head linkages -- (pv0041 & pv0044)
10.) landing gear (PV0035)
11.) fuel tank and guts for it (PV0363)
12.) Main Rotor Hub (PV0354)
13.) Mixing Lever (PV0004)
14.) Flybar Control Rod [loops] (PV0005)

Specific to 50:
15.) Main 85 tooth gear (AK0148)
16.) Tail Boom (PV0393)
17.) Thunder Tiger 600mm Carbon Blades (3827)
18.) Canopy w/ windshield & extras (PV0364)
19.) Decal Sheet (PV0389)

In Crash Kit:
20.) Tail Boom (30 size, not 50 size)
21.) flybar paddles (PV0036) (Crash Kit)
22.) flybar (PV0008) (Crash Kit)
23.) feathering spindle (in crash kit)
24.) AK0029 Main shaft (Crash Kit)

want:
25.) JR Decal Sheet
26.) O.S. Engines decal sheet
27.) carbon graphite base plate (PV0326)
08-29-2003 Over year old.
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maddog7
Senior Heliman
Location: Monkseaton, Newcastle, UK

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		AAW,

Sorry for shouting but


WTF HAPPENED JUST B4 THE CRASH?

I would recommend NOT stripping the heli until after you tell me.


Cheers (someone who suffered the same)

David
08-30-2003 Over year old.
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AcesAreWld
Senior Heliman
Location: NJ Shore

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		maddog,

Ok.. here comes the play by play.

I fly the heli and burn out a plug.... I've been way too lean. I land and change my plug, etc.. then old man goes up flying on Chan 18. I didn't even KNOW he was on cahn 18 cause he didn't impound his transmitter. Anyway, he flies, I refuel, change plug, and richen mixture.

I fly again... tweak engine to PERFECTION... nice and rich, GREAT power, smooth transitions, no burping, its perfect.. adjust throttle, pitch, and REVO settings... happy as can be.

I start flying it aorund.. mostly "gentle".. but as the guys say at the field, "gentle" for me is NOT gentle. I am doing some hard turns and stuff... then I start to amp it up. I do some inverted, some pullouts inverted, inverted hover, spin it around, stall turns, etc. Its GREAT! I am in LLOOOVVEEE...

Then, I flip it out of IDLE-UP and put her into HOVER mode, I put the throttle to idle and begin to decend in an auto-like fashion. I then nose dive, so that I can buzz the deck low and fast before I start my REALLY gentle low and slow flying... on the way down, I ALWAYS cheat a little.. I never go STRAIGHT down, I always nose up a LITTLE bit, to make sure I have control... well guess what, this time I DIDN'T. The second I GENTLY pulled back and didnt have a responce, many thoughts ran thru my head. Number 1 was that the canopy came loose and went back into the elevator arm controls. I read about it here on RR, my landing gear is on backwards (on-purpose) maybe I didnt grind enuf away with the dremel tool and it came loose. So I pull harder.. nothing.. so I jam the stick forwards and backwards, to see if it moves at all, to see if I get any reposnce and free it up.. nothing.. nothing at all. I yell out "OH SH|T!" and I move the stick FRANTICALLY forwards and backwards.. then just backwards.... I try some aileron input to see if I can budge anyhting lose and move it... nothing... I pulled back as hard as I could, and I watched it go STRAIGHT DOWN, STRIAGHT in.. bounce once, and stop. Then I watched all the parts land and come to rest. After the crash, the Rx unit was DESTROYED.. beyond any repair, testing, anything. When I came home I plugged the servo into another RX... moved smoothly. Battery charged, no binding. even after a MASSIVE desturction, the servos still operate smoothly, no stripped gears, no binding, no mechanical problems, nothing. Even after that crash! I can find NOTHING wrong, nothign to cause it, nothing. I am AMAZED that it didn't even crack the main frames! It ripped the body posts out, it destroyed the servo tray, servo cases, RX unit, etc... but no frame damage really. I went to the hobby shop, U-Fly-Hobbies and struck a deal.. an offer I could NOT refuse. Needless to say, I am getting a NEW Raptor 50 kit (less engine and muffler), JR 531 Servos, a JR 5000T or 550T gyro, and a servo that goes with it.. an 8700G or something to that sort. Add onto that a JR 7 chan Rx unit, and WOW. The guys at this new Local Hobby Shop are GREAT.. very helpful and interested in seeing you succede and have fun.. Their buisiness is based upon you ENJOYING yourself and coming back for more. Great people. If anyone is interested, their name is "U Fly Hobbies" located in Freehold, NJ. Their Phone number is 732-780-3046 and their web site is coming along soon.

Well, I always try to improve my heli after a crash... but WOW.. a whole new heli, new servos, gyro, battery, Rx, U name it... its new.. and its gonna ROCK. The new Raptor 50 V2 is gonna be SWEET.. still upset I won't be flying until then, but everything worked out for the best

WAHOO! ALL NEW HELI, BETTER THAN BEFORE!
--Geoff
"Aces Are WILD!"
08-30-2003 Over year old.
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psiros
Heliman
Location: Mission Viejo, CA

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		not a total loss...

Hey, at least the tailbox and fins are ok Not EVERYTHING was totaled.

Seriously, that blows. Its cool though, because you get to rip it apart and have fun building it all over again... just like when you first got it.

I'm probably not making the situation any better, am I?
08-30-2003 Over year old.
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maddog7
Senior Heliman
Location: Monkseaton, Newcastle, UK

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Geoff,
If you were not shot down I think I know what MAY have happened, If you have not binned some of the bits you might be able to check.
I bought a new 50V2 kit not so long ago and I, like you was absolutely in love with it. Its spooky how similar the circumstances were.
I was just warming up a little and after about five minutes I lost all cyclic control and it went in V Hard nose first. The impact was so hard it bent the boom and the boom did not actually hit anything diectly. luckily I have it on video. If I show you the piccies of mine (I will later) you will be shocked how similar the damage was. I too suffered major trauma about it. Its not so bad if you have a bad 'un and you KNOW it was you, but when you don't its soul destroying.

Anyway, when I built my 50 I remember thinking that the washout pins were a little easier to insert than on the 30 I had previously. I wish I had payed more heed to this and glued them in right away. I thought " Oh well the 30 ones just must have been bloody tight!"

I was so PŁ%^&D after the crash that I set about finding the cause like a man on a mission.

What did I find, well one washout pin was completely gone and the other was half way out!! It is so unlikely that this was CAUSED by the crash since these pins have miniscule inertia and most of the rest of the washout assy was still intact. The other MAJOR clue was the direction of the shearing of the link arm (top to bottom) which suggests that the pin had fallen out and the link turned 90 deg before the swash cut the link (see pics)

I have subsequently bought another 2 R50s and they were both the same so I developed a technique to cyano them in. (without drilling holes in the arms which does not work well)

This works great, but one day just prior to flight I'm checking control surfaces and hear one of the servos binding. Elevator! (arm) it turns out that the bloody pin had fallen out of that as well (how lucky) Upon checking, both birds ALSO had loose elevator arm pins. So I glued them in as well and, touch wood, no problems for the last couple of months.

Hope this may have shed some light, let me know what you find.

I'll try and post the vid and some pics soon
Cheers
David.
08-30-2003 Over year old.
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Dazzler
Elite Veteran
Location: Ohio

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Thundertiger is good for making those push in pins, and having the owner hope they dont fall out. I dont understand why they dont supply those pins with a groove at the end, and a C clip to hold it on. On my R70 I modified all my pins to make sure they dont fall out, some with the CA trick, and some with pins with C clips.

Daz...
08-30-2003 Over year old.
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maddog7
Senior Heliman
Location: Monkseaton, Newcastle, UK

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		folks for your viewing pleasure
http://www.maddog7.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/R50crash.mpg

this is what happened

Piccies to follow.
08-30-2003 Over year old.
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AcesAreWld
Senior Heliman
Location: NJ Shore

My Posts This: Topic  Forum
Quote 
was just warming up a little and after about five minutes I lost all cyclic control and it went in V Hard nose first. The impact was so hard it bent the boom and the boom did not actually hit anything diectly.


ME TOO, to the "T".. exact same thing there...

Quote 
Its not so bad if you have a bad 'un and you KNOW it was you, but when you don't its soul destroying.


EXACTLY! You REALLY RAELLY do understand... my 3 heli crashes were:
1.) Tail belt broke on ZXX Shuttle (not my faiult it went, my fault I didn't auto it to safety)
2.) Mid-Air with Cuz (not my fault)
3.) THIS ONE..

None were really "dumb thumbs"... if I put it in becasue I messed up, then at least I earned it.. these were all cheater crashes.. it sucks!

ok, I'm a little confised... are you talkinb about THESE pins from this pic:


Are those teh washout pins? Those are the pins that go into the washout base, so I assume that's what U mean.. I don;t know the names of all the parts ("Flybar Control Rod" is "Loop thing in the rotorhead")

Anyway, mine is actually VERY VERY VERY tight still, I was playing with the remains of the rotor hub and I couldnt pull those pins out even when wiggling them and trying to get 'em out. So I don't think that was it, however on my new R50 kit I certainly will be checking that out!

Man Maddog, you really understand where I'm comin from.. and it isnt a fun place to be.

psiros:
Yeah... fun.. yippie... I get to build all new ball links, and get those DAMN clips on the autorotation shaft with just 2 pair of pliers... those are the 2 things I hate most about building the helis.. the ball link building and the clips on that shaft. sigh.. the oter was so perfect.. I even has all the phillips screws facing the same "+" direction so it looked SO nice and perfect.. and I did it without overtighting or undertighteneing any of them.... it was perfect.... perfect I tell ya!

All well.. time to get dressed (9:35 AM here) and pick up my sister from college for the Labor Day weekend... I wish I was FLYING right now! (And it'd not like I'm gonna put my PLANK in the air!... right?... hmm... maybe I will.. )

--Geoff
"Aces Are Wild"
www.rchelicam.com
08-30-2003 Over year old.
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scouse
Senior Heliman
Location: UK Liverpool

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Can u buy those upgrade pins with the clips?
The only ones ive seen come with the alloy upgrades kit.

Thx
08-30-2003 Over year old.
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maddog7
Senior Heliman
Location: Monkseaton, Newcastle, UK

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		AAW,

No mate NOT those pins, look in the manual they are at stage 5 part numbers bk0079 which hold bk0015 an bk0016 together.

Also check the elevator arm pins (stage 6 bk0084)

I really feel for you, and I know if you find out, as I did, that it wasn't your fault, you'll not feel so bad and your confidence will recover quicker

Have you looked at the video in my last post? It went dead 5 seconds before impact. You can 'feel/see' it happen in the vid if you look closely.

I have lots of piccies to show you but I cant upload them to RR till monday.

May stick them on my homepages for you to take a look at.
Cheers
David.
08-30-2003 Over year old.
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maddog7
Senior Heliman
Location: Monkseaton, Newcastle, UK

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Scouse,
Your probably just as well gluing the originals, if done correctly you wont get them out again unless you use an axe!

If you need details PM or post.

Cheers
David
08-30-2003 Over year old.
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maddog7
Senior Heliman
Location: Monkseaton, Newcastle, UK

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		**** Scouse, I just realised not only do you have the same ship as me, exactly the same number of posts as me (well U did B4 this one) but you registered at the same time. Your bird's not called Carol as well is she? hehe

David.
08-30-2003 Over year old.
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scouse
Senior Heliman
Location: UK Liverpool

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		LOL Maddog7,

Narr her names jenny, same number of posts again he he.
Ill giv the CA thing a go seen it mentioned b4.
08-30-2003 Over year old.
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maddog7
Senior Heliman
Location: Monkseaton, Newcastle, UK

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Scouse, make sure you use the grease method, don't drill the arms and drop cyano in it doesn't work Very well.

NEways the weather up here in Whitley Bay has just taken an unexpected turn for the better so I think I'll go fly.
L8Rs
D
08-30-2003 Over year old.
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scouse
Senior Heliman
Location: UK Liverpool

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Well uve lost me on the grease method drilling an a drop of CA was the only method i knew of.
If u can tell us bout the grease method (as long as its not to intrusive ) then ill giv it a go.

Thx
Mark
08-30-2003 Over year old.
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maddog7
Senior Heliman
Location: Monkseaton, Newcastle, UK

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Mark,

When assembling the bits, on 1 end of the wash out arm (the bit with two holes in that attaches to the swash BK0016) brush some grease over the inner facing surface and inside the hole. Then use a sewing needle to very carefully put some SLOW/THICK CA or 2 part epoxy inside the wash out mixing arm, (the bit that goes to the washout base BK0015) take care not to get any on the surface facing the washout arm. Then assemble this by pushing the pin in from the side which you have NOT greased.
If you use CA you MUST do this in one quick motion, if you dont you'll never get it out again, you only get 1 shot (I knackered my first one first time) at least with epoxy you get 5 mins minimum to get it right.
I pressed the whole assy against the table top to get it to go quickly.


2 final points:
Dry assemble first and make sure you have the arms the right way round, work out how much force you'll need and use appropriate glue.

IF you have ANY questions or something is not clear please ask me again, better that than having to buy new bits!!

Actually better to screw it up once and have to buy new bits than buy a new heli if it falls out!
Cheers David.

btw I just had my second dumb crash flying in the dark!
08-30-2003 Over year old.
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AcesAreWld
Senior Heliman
Location: NJ Shore

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Looked up the step you referanced in the manual.. ah yes, the "washout pins" are called "washout pins". Now I see what you are talking about...

Also, I saw the video.. MAN oh MAN.. I see exactly where you lose control, it flounders for a sec.. and then STRAIGHT in, like mine.

Anyway... my washout pins and washout unit are prob the BEST intact part of my rotorhead. The crash was definetly not them. With each passing second, its points more and more towards radio hit. (in fact, I'm sold)...

I am talking on the phone while writing this post, and I can't keep my thougths straight.. so I'll post it and write more later

--Geoff
08-31-2003 Over year old.
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zoro
Senior Heliman
Location: Darwin, Australia

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		yeah i'd be weighing up the price of ya parts in comparison 2 the cost of a new machine like raffy suggested.sorry 2 hear bout the crash mate but i guess we assume the risk at start up. just gotta keep breathin i reckon. she'll be right!!!
08-31-2003 Over year old.
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daggit
Elite Veteran
Location: Waseca MN

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		AcesAreWld...

Well, I went and done it. totaled my Rappy yesterday. I piled it in pretty hard. Flew most of the day testing my limits. SMACKED it hard doing a loop and ran out of sky. It was a contagious crash. My brother-in-law was flying at the same time. He crashed when he looked over to see my crash (his was rather minor). Mine stuck at full throttle and I had to run over and yank the fuel line. Battery came unplugged so I couldn't throttle down.

Appears that all the electonics survived, but I broke both frame halves. SPendy crash.
08-31-2003 Over year old.
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Crashed? Discussion and Photos > Raptor 50 V2.. waas perfect, now totaled
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