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Crashed? Discussion and Photos > radio hit by cell phone
 
 
cootertwo
Senior Heliman
Location: Labelle Florida USA

My Posts This: Topic  Forum

Hey! I can sit here in front of my computer, and dial my cell phone with my land line, and just BEFORE my cell phone rings, I get clicks and noises on my computer!

One Day At A Time
06-17-2004 Over year old.
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cootertwo
Senior Heliman
Location: Labelle Florida USA

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Thanks Naomi!

http://www.futaba-rc.com/faq/product-faq.html#q278



Is there any risk to using cellular phones in close proximity with my radio?
There are two separate parts to this question—frequency transmission interference vs. computer processor interference.

FREQUENCY: While most fields do not recommend the use of cell phones for liability reasons, there should never be a frequency problem between cell phones and radio systems. The FCC makes sure that neither cell phones, nor R/C frequencies are close enough in range to interfere with each other and they enforce this policy actively. We have many fliers in high cell phone use areas, who have never encountered frequency problems related to cell phones, but once again, with the volume of cell phones today, and for safety sake, it is best not to fly during a large amount of cell phone use in the area of the flying field.

PROCESSOR: There have been a few reported cases of modelers seeming to encounter strange programming issues with their computer radios when used in the vicinity of an operating cell phone. We have never seen this nor can we replicate it; however, when it comes to safety we always recommend the modeler err on the side of caution and avoid use of your radio equipment in close proximity with a cellular phone which is turned on.

It is always best to take all possible precautions to avoid a situation that could potentially harm someone. Therefore, we recommend limiting the proximity of powered-on cellular phones to at least 1000 feet from any radio in operation.

One Day At A Time
06-17-2004 Over year old.
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brooksnb
Key Veteran
Location: Sussex , New Brunswick , Canada

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Real planes seem to have a concern about cell phones...and they have some pretty high end equiptment on board...perhaps they know something can happen and for that reason alone it does sound logical that we be very aware of cell phones and possible hits too.

Never, under any circumstances, take a sleeping pill and a laxative on the same night.... Dennis
06-17-2004 Over year old.
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JackR
Heliman
Location: Alpharetta, Georgia USA

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		My theory has probably been posted already even though I didn't see any after a quick scan of the replies...

There is absolutely no transmitter in existence that is "clean". Especially consumer electronics. Every electronic device will emit some level of radiation. The specified frequency of any transmitter (cell phone, CB radio, etc.) does not mean that it's not transmitting on other frequencies at the same time, at reduced power. These are called "spurs" and are present in the output of any transmitter. That's why cell phones are banned aboard commercial air flights. The trick in the comm industry is to reduce the spurs to within whatever constraints are allowed by law. The constraints usually specify that the power of the spurs cannot not exceed such-and-such a voltage per meter distance from the device and are based on a number of other factors as well.

As far as laptops go, they are excellent transmitters of radio signals and any external wiring such as mouse cables, video cables, etc., make very good transmitting/receiving antennas for the computer.

As far as interference during the ring cycle of a cell phone, who knows what goes on inside? If that's what happens, then that's what happens. The main point is that one should not assume that just because you have a "2gHz" telephone that it will not also be radiating on your R/C receive frequency at some low level.
06-20-2004 Over year old.
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astro-g
Senior Heliman
Location: Wellington, New Zealand

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		that depends on

the kind of plane.
Light aircraft that fly under instrument flight rules often use cells as a kind of back-up comms.
and my gliding instructor took business calls during my soarign lessons.

Large commercial airliners have fly by wire controlls and fantastically sensitive navigation instruments.
there is a reason the require passengers to turn off ALL electronic devices during take off and landing.

When you are using a radio beacon - auto landing system, trying to hit a 20m wide spot on a runway at 300kts, from 20KM away, and fraction of a degree's variance caused by elecrtronic interference even slightly skewing one of the signals could be catastrophic
06-21-2004 Over year old.
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Lock-Tite
Veteran
Location: Quebec, Canada

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Hi guys, I did not read everything you posted here (too long), but here I see Curtis wearing his cellular phone at the XFC



Does the XFC or other funflies have regulations regarding pilot or spectators wearing cellular phones ?

Frank
Dont forget to bring a clean pair of shorts when flying 3D ;)
06-21-2004 Over year old.
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astro-g
Senior Heliman
Location: Wellington, New Zealand

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		doesnt curtis fly JR?

or maybe he doesnt use a synth module.
06-22-2004 Over year old.
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Lock-Tite
Veteran
Location: Quebec, Canada

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		I don't think he is using a synth module.
So those hits occur only with synth modules ?

Frank
Dont forget to bring a clean pair of shorts when flying 3D ;)
06-22-2004 Over year old.
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heli1man
Senior Heliman
Location: Chautauqua Lake, NY

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Frank to be honest with you I don't think they occur at all. It just blows my mind that people think they need to have a cell phone Just another testimony to how people are never satisified. When I'm flying, or hunting, or fishing, or lying in the hammok with a cold barley pop, I don't want anyone calling. I don't give a sh!t about the game the weather the condition or state of my digestion. Just let me have some peace!

Still don't think the cell hits the Frequency we have for air RC though.

Good excuse for the dumb thumbs..................Oh no.....crash!!!!.......................OK WHO HAS A CELL PHONE?.................................All hands of the technology sheep go up .........check yourselves!

Bill

Eco 8 Brushless, MS composits Raptor30v2 39TT 550TT carbons Shogun 400 Brushless 3 cell lipo.
06-23-2004 Over year old.
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wolfdad
Key Veteran
Location: Southern Maryland

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Concur with your cell phone philsophy! I have one of the GD things purely and simply to notify someone in case I have an emergency. Cheapest plan I could get was with 400 minutes and I couldn't talk on a phone for 400 minutes in a month if somebody had a gun to my head....nor would I....I hate phones, in general.

Now, as to affecting our radios, I have to wave the BS flag!!! This post has been circulating here at RR for over a year and, still, I've seen no conclusive evidence that a cell phone would affect anything we do. If a cell phone was on my belt while I was flying and the GD thing rang, it would probably interrupt my concentration enough to "dumb thumb" it right into mother earth....so the simple solution is to sh*t-can the cell phone while you are flying. Of course that removes one more excuse.

I'm more concerned that the GD cell phone might affect my defibrillator than my transmitter, however good old Medtronics will "neither confirm nor deny" that it will...again, another reason to heave that POS as far as I can....that and the boneheads driving around with one glued to their ear. Man! That pisses me off!

Off the soapbox!

wolfdad sends....

"There are those who have...and, those who will" IRCHA #2117, AMA #70068, Turbine Waiver #105
06-23-2004 Over year old.
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Sar
Elite Veteran
Location: Kingston, NY

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		I guess I'm just not popular enough for my cell to bother me, it rings once or twice a day at most. Work knows better than to call me on the weekends, all my heli buddies are at the field (or calling me to see if I'm at the field). I didn't sell my soul into marriage so there's no wife calling every 10 minutes to see if I'm done yet.

If more people called me constantly I might join you guys in your tarpaper covered unabomber style clubhouse..

--
Jon
06-23-2004 Over year old.
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Fullagas
Key Veteran
Location: Michigan

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		.
Naomi, good post!


Uuhhh........

Why not just turn the flippin' thing off? I do. That's why I'm at the field, to get away from such distractions.

Next topic:

Best beginner heli.




.

I might not be very good, but I'm fun to watch.
06-23-2004 Over year old.
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Dan C
Senior Heliman
Location: Barnsley, Yorkshire

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Perhaps one of the things not taken into account by folks yet regarding mobile phones is the location.

I understand most mobile phones and the base stations can vary the RF power ( as part of the handset battery saving stratagy) that is used to communicate with the cell so if you are nice and near a tower the thing will only maybe transmit a couple of mW but it the tower and phone are struggling to communicate both I guess will ratchit up the RF power to keep comms.

bear in mind Tx in the UK are legally limited to something like 10mW and it could be similar in the rest of the world

It could be something simple like your mobile phone ariel is damaged and while striggling to communicate with the tower it tells the tower it transmitting at X power so the tower makes a judgement on how much power it needs to keep comms and hence the blanking of other signals

I thought in the UK mobile handsets were limited to 600mW and car based phones a couple of watts but the base station could be tranmitting at 10's of watts in response to a poor signal and the reported power the handset was transmitting on

this is my SWAG ( stupid wild arse guess)
06-23-2004 Over year old.
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Imperio
Senior Heliman
Location: tecumseh okla 7487 ph405-598-6267

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Interference

hey I have a motorola flip phone and when it ring's it will disrupt my home computer' and it will do the same for a transmitter as well' i have seen that with my 2 green eye's in total disbeleif and disgust' hospital's don't want cell phone's around there computerized eqiupment for a reason and this is it' turn off your phone before flying or at least keep it away from the Transmitter
07-02-2004 Over year old.
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Heli_Kiwi
Heliman
Location: Sydney, Australia

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Being an aircraft engneer on 747's, I can assure you that using your cellphone in flight IS NOT a good idea, as spurious signals can and do affect the delicate navigational components in an aircraft. We have all heard about how much wire is in a 747 (lots) but untill you actually see how dependant these aircraft are on small electric currents you just dont appreciate it. With the increased popularity of 'fly by wire' aircraft which do away with mechanical links to flight controls - this problem is only going to get worse.

Also, try sitting you cellphone next to your moniter while using your computer, and see the regular short bursts it sends out affect the monitor.
07-05-2004 Over year old.
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G.Man
rrProfessor
Location: Bristol

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		I am in agreement with Heli_kiwi here, the phone does not seem to cause direct interference to the radio signal, but when in close proximity to the TX and it rings I am convinced the increase in RF upsets the electronics...

You can witness it when placed next to a monitor, when placed next to a wired phone, a stereo, in your car... sometimes even on a bluetooth headset...

A cell phone does transmit more power, longer when it is ringing or being used...



Don't Email me as I wont reply - PM Only (spam countermeasures)
07-07-2004 Over year old.
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greatwhitehuntr
Heliman
Location: santa barbara,ca

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		cell phone

next time I wipe out I'll see if that exuse works
07-17-2004 Over year old.
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AustinTatious
Heliman
Location: Hurst, Texas

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		My .02

I jsut thought I woudl throw in from my experiences what one should do when a radio goes into Lock or you get "hit"

1. Hold TX as High as you can with Antenna Pointed strat up ( unless your model is directly above your Head!) Basically you want the antenna @90 degrees from the Model..

2. at the same Time as you are doign this, CALL OUT YOUR FREQUENCY!!! this way if somone has jsut turned on and is within Earshot.. they Hopefully turn off.

3. Let everyone know YOU DONT HAVE CONTROL...

So we have helped our signal.. warned the Nice person whom mearly FORGOT the Fq Pin.. and now we are telling everyone to LOOKOUT....


This is my opinion.. Only once in 15 years have I ever had an Accident due to interferance... I did all but number 2, which would have saved a great flying Ship.

IF you ahve somthign else to add.. throw it in.. I dont know squat!

Austin

ps.. Ive got a killer deal on a Fury Going right now in the classifieds!

Austin Williams
08-12-2004 Over year old.
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Aaron29
Elite Veteran
Location: Bossier City, LA

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Why need a cell when airborne?

I for one in part agree with heli1man. There is no reason your cell phone needs to be on when you are flying your heli. Leave it on at the bench at least. What are you going to do? Answer it in the middle of a piroflip?

I put mine near my computer, and everytime I receive a call my computer freaks out. I get all kinds of buzzing and the screen does a little as well. In fact it happens before it rings sometimes I can beat it. And some people are going to say there is "always RF" from a cell phone. While probably true, it peaks when it rings. And that is not a chance I'm willing to take with my heli, which is not only expensive but dangerous.

my 2C

-Aaron
08-17-2004 Over year old.
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Thomas L Erb
Veteran
Location: Alliance ohio

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		wow Im amazed at some of the things i have read here. For those that didnt read the begining of this thread I am the person that started this thread. the reason that i did it was to inform all about what happened to me . First off i you fly a crystaled module then none of this should have any effect on you based on my experience. This only was aimed at you all that fly a synth module. I HAD a problem with my cell phone when it was less then 2 feet away from my module. I say had because my phone now stays in my truck or at least behind the flightline when i am at any field . This problem has nothing to do with the quality of the radio that i fly only that i believe that this is just one of those querrky combinations that happens . I cant explaine it but i can repeat it at any time . This post was to warn others of the possiability of this happing so that what happened to me doesnt happen to them. for those that have made it clear that they hate cell phones take a beath before you hurt yourself. There are good and bad sides to all things on this earth. We need to focus on the bight side If this wouldnt have happend to me it could have been YOU that spent $876.43 to repair two machines. so all who reads this please stick to the subject matter and be happy I know i am Tom
08-21-2004 Over year old.
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Crashed? Discussion and Photos > radio hit by cell phone
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