OICU812
rrProfessor
Location: Grande Prairie, Alberta, Canada
My Posts This: Topic Forum | Popcorn needed, open to debate :DThere are alot of debates, electric versus nitro. Now as Electric is becoming alot more main stream it seems their are more makers, more myths and assumptions of lipos being made. I wrote this to perhaps bring some light to some things I have discovered in the past few years being a hardcore electric guy. This post is not in advertisement, not in negativity towards your choice as a consumer. In reading various threads of lipo discussions across various boards I wanted to add some of my thoughts.
**NOTE** this post assumes YOU the user are obeying your 80% rule, and have some knowledge of lipo care, regardless of brand or size. 
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Here is my personal opinion stance on this I do not consider myself an expert but rather an experienced electric user, popcorn ready cause it may be abit of a read  . While I will poke the nerves of some please have an open mind as this I have found to be true in my journey.
(Prior to read), I have ZERO beef with Zippy, they are simply example of one of the cheaper mass makers, re-sellers of cheap lipos. In the right application I have a few myself, but going along here...
If you are a beginner: "MEANING" you are hovering, piddling about and not even into much fast forward flight. "NO" disrespect here intended either folks, we all started as beginners ok? , Allright moving along...
If you are a begginner. Sometimes budget is a first off concern as you been consumed by the "WOW" holy crap this hobby is addictive and my wife might kill me feeling. Heehee
Cheaper batteries always seem to catch the eye first, of course they do right?. Rightfully so in todays economy, however there is something I want to discuss in electrics, and in some ways this relates to the good old electric versus nitro debates..
"PRICE PER USABLE FLIGHT" << THIS IS IMPORTANT TO UNDERSTAND
What is a "useable flight"?? you may ask...
A Useable flight to me is where regardless of heli, cell count you get a consistent performance, meaning same or near same power for the duration of the flight, up to what is recommended of using 80% of the useable MAH "capacity" of the pack.
MANY times this is not considered and overlooked, many, many times.
Zippies, Rhinos and lipos such as this attract new users, people with $$ on the mind , and people who flat out believe they are expendable in sorts and that the same saying "I can buy 3 for the price of one Hyperion or TP45C" true yes, BUT you are not achieving the same "useable flights". Some have done this test and been down this road and learn this very fact.
When you are a begginer maybe a "useable flight" as described may not matter so much, fair enough. BUT as you progress you will notice that the not useable flights when a cheaper constructed and mis labelled 40C Zippy pack which is actually 26-30C pack at best starts to poop out on you. It simply is "not as fun". Those cycles to me are what I consider to be dead cycles, I don't fly them as you have to change your flight style to accomadate flight pack deterioration.
With the new TP45C and Hyperion packs having different chemistry you can achieve "useable" flights for 3-4 times the cycles, so this formula being considered the value "IS THERE" on such lipos. "useable flights" are easily seen on using eagle tree or Hyperion E meter devices, although drops can be slight in some cases of the Zippys etc, they are easily recorded and seen with such devices and as they do deteriorate. After their useable flights portion of the cycle life, they become pyhsically easy to see in flight and feel.
NOW!!... not to jump around but if you're crashing alot, "MAYBE" a cheapo pack is ok for you, maybe you don't make it to 50 cycles before you crash? I dunno, I am being open minded and agreeing with you if this is your case. Whatever works for you the user.
Keep in mind not all lipos are created alike fellas whether you believe it or not , also realize that there is not one central place these are all being created. The MYTH that all lipos are from the same place, heatshrunk with a vendor/manufacturers name is complete BS folks, I assure you of this very thing.
Several NON sponsored people have provided such testing on RCG to show the TP45C and Hyperion technology cycle life, take those proven cycles provided with concrete data and you will see the "price per flight" value of some of the higher end lipos, like the new TPs and Hyperions. Data of both the TP and Hyp are there with results in cases of over 300 flights with only loss in MAH capacity and not in useable flight.
Now this is where it gets interesting...
If you are an "advanced" pilot. By defintion you are starting or are pushing the heli to the labelled "C" continuous and Burst limits. You also or may be running a system which demands are that to the higher limits of a packs outputs, this next piece pertains to you folks..
Cheaper construction packs which have far less QC measure, no aging time prior to release, no guranteed cell matching practices will show their "price" difference here in a negative light.
6S example on a HV systems: AKA Logo 500, T-Rex 600, Outrage 550
If you buy Pack A "their best version" - "Zippy, Rhino, and a few such as these" at say 140USD shipped, lets say you buy 3, so $420. Each of those A packs gets 60 "useable" <<key word flights, so you got 180 flights between the 3 packs, thus a price of $2.33 per flight.
Now Pack B: "TP45C, Hyperion G3X" $228HP,-$280.oo USD (1) Pack
Proven by testing and account of idependant testors not affiliated to show "useable" cycles of over 160 cycles (+) you are getting Quality control, good connetors, cell matching, aging process prior to delivery to consumer, and most important "TRUE" C rating that is obvious in eagle tree or Hyperion E meter testing. Now a price per flight of at max value pack shown of new technology of $1.75 all of which are useable flights with a higher C rating and more performance as well. So conclude on that, not only cheaper, but more enjoyable, more powerfull flights, "if" this is a bonus factor for you?..maybe
That being said, are you really gaining or losing??, you decide, proof is in the pudding as the old saying goes.
Now on top of this do not forget you can not charge pack A cheaper pack at 5-6C, so your time may or may not be worth it, plus since you are getting the value you in fact need "less" packs.
Again not to ruffle feathers, I been being quite about this for awhile. But there are reasons that Hobby King will not send lipos to indendant non sponsored users that have knowledge and will show "TRUE" data of their lipos, reason is simple. They are not true to their labbeling point 1, point 2 longevity in "useable" cycles is not there for an experience user with a system matched to "THEIR" advertised abilities of their lipos and they count on the economies scare tactic of "IM CHEAP". Next...Warranty, crash replacements, customer support, knowledge base of course all of importance if you value your money based on dollar per object in view.
There is no disputing that lipos are expensive in general in comparisons to other parts of our every day lives, some or worth the bucks some are not. Point I suppose I am trying to make is when deciding don't discount the newest products, I do sincerely as a long time E user, believe we are entering past the hype zone and based on allot of elaborate, detailed testing we are in a new revolution of lipos with the newest chemistry and cell structure techniques.
In the end do what you like, but be open minded and take into consideration your situation. If you are dead set on cheaper is better, go that route it is your choice, this was not intended regardless of how you take it to convince you otherwise, it is just what I have experienced as some others have as well. If you are not crashing much anymore, or you can see the math consider your options, they're there and they are getting better ever single day.
While in mentioning brands, the goal of this NO MATTER what "YOU" pick is to shed light for people for their needs and to be open minded to "USEABLE" flights, and to see value in "price per useable flights". Be well
Shawn
...Once upon a time there were Nitros, flybars and frequency pins... |
