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e-Electric Motors & Controllers > Anyone using Kontronik Jive Escs with a Spark Arrester?
 
 
TomC
Veteran
Location: Gold Coast, Queensland, Australia

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		I am thinking about upgrading some of my Jazz escs to Jive's (better gov's, built-in ubec's, and maybe 12s) and I'd like a little advice please.

I've always used spark arrestors (usually a ~60-100ohm 1-2 watt pre-connect resistor) with my Jazz escs (not an issue with my PowerJazz escs since they have in-built spark suppression). The spark arrestors have made my 4mm bullet connectors last forever, and no sparks!

I don't want to debate if spark arrestors are necessary but I would like to know if there are any problems using them with the Jive HV escs. Thanks.

Cheers,
TomC

CX2 2s
Logo10- 3D 5s
Trex600 10s HC-Rigid
2x Ion-x, 1x15s DS, 1x10s SS
10-04-2009 08:16 AM
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jrockstuart
Elite Veteran
Location: Allen, Texas

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Do you have a picture of a DIY spark arrestor?

MinAir Spectra-G
Trex 450Pro V-bar /Scorpion /JR
Wally Motors/New England Heli/DL Canopies
10-04-2009 08:07 PM
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TomC
Veteran
Location: Gold Coast, Queensland, Australia

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		I'll try to post a couple of pics of my little spark arrestor. I use a 1 watt 80 ohm resistor. Do a search on Spark Arrestors and I'm sure you'll find lots of other info on them.

Cheers,
TomC



CX2 2s
Logo10- 3D 5s
Trex600 10s HC-Rigid
2x Ion-x, 1x15s DS, 1x10s SS
10-04-2009 10:24 PM
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MrMel
rrProfessor
Location: Lidingo, Sweden (GMT+1)

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Only Kontronik can answer, I know from a discussion with CC that using the wrong resistor = bad, and issues with lipo cell detection, where as correct resistor = OK.

Which one is OK for Kontronik however, I dont know.

My site: http://heli.dacsa.net
10-04-2009 10:55 PM
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jrockstuart
Elite Veteran
Location: Allen, Texas

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		And this setup will keep the connectors from melting on the HV setups when you first plug them together?

MinAir Spectra-G
Trex 450Pro V-bar /Scorpion /JR
Wally Motors/New England Heli/DL Canopies
10-05-2009 11:47 AM
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skint eastwood
Heliman
Location: uk

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		I emailed Kontroniks about this, they replied saying that they didnt recommend doing this, they also said 80 ohm was to much, dont quite know why they said the two things
10-05-2009 12:27 PM
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TomC
Veteran
Location: Gold Coast, Queensland, Australia

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		jrock,

Ya, using this system has resulted in no sparks or connector pitting (or melting) on my HV set-ups.

skint,

Thanks for that mate. I'm not sure why Kontronik would say 80 ohms is too much but I'm sure they have their reasons. I've never had much luck getting a straightforward answer from them.

I usually find that if the ohms are too high then the esc will not arm. If it is too low, it does not arrest the spark. I just try a few different ones and usually find that somewhere between 60-100 ohms works fine.

Aside;
It's a real pity that Kontronik did not transfer over the spark suppression on the PowerJazz to the Jive's imho.

Cheers,
TomC

CX2 2s
Logo10- 3D 5s
Trex600 10s HC-Rigid
2x Ion-x, 1x15s DS, 1x10s SS
10-05-2009 09:30 PM
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helicraze
Elite Veteran
Location: Victoria - Australia

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		I agree, it would have been nice.

But i think if your connectors are clean the spark is not very bad. I use genuine deans and clean them every few months and they are still fine.
10-05-2009 11:21 PM
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jrockstuart
Elite Veteran
Location: Allen, Texas

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		How high a voltage/amperage are you using with your Deans?

MinAir Spectra-G
Trex 450Pro V-bar /Scorpion /JR
Wally Motors/New England Heli/DL Canopies
10-05-2009 11:36 PM
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helicraze
Elite Veteran
Location: Victoria - Australia

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Well its 12S 90 size electric, deans don't get warm really. I guess averages under 50amps and well over 100amps spikes for sure.
Done hundreds of flights
10-05-2009 11:39 PM
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CRCR
Senior Heliman
Location: NZ

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Does the sudden surge of current from a 10s or 12s setup do any damage to the capacitors or ESC on the Jive 80HV?
or is it only the spark damage to the connectors that is the real problem?

I was going to set up a spark arrestor but after reading this maybe its better to put up with the spark??

What are other Jive users doing?
10-15-2009 11:37 PM
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Heli 770
rrProfessor
Location: Lemon Grove, Ca. USA.

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		MrMel

By any chance did CC. tell you what was the right resistors to use on there ESCs?
10-15-2009 11:57 PM
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TomC
Veteran
Location: Gold Coast, Queensland, Australia

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		I found that 80 ohms 1-2 watt resistors worked fine with all Kontronik Jazz escs and CC Hv85 and HV110. Did not seem to muck anything up (eg lipo count).

The spark itself is really only harmful to the connectors, not the Esc caps since they are pretty robust on both Kontronik and CC escs.

Sure wish all escs had built-in spark arrestors like my PowerJazz escs.

Cheers,
TomC

CX2 2s
Logo10- 3D 5s
Trex600 10s HC-Rigid
2x Ion-x, 1x15s DS, 1x10s SS
10-16-2009 01:30 AM
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Heli 770
rrProfessor
Location: Lemon Grove, Ca. USA.

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Thanks, Tom.
10-16-2009 01:33 AM
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bexander
Heliman
Location: Gothenburg, Sweden

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		I checked with kontronik about my Jive 80+ HV and they told me to use a 5-6ohm 1W resistor. I tested it yesterday with a 5.6ohm 2W resistor. No more sparks
10-16-2009 06:35 AM
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TomC
Veteran
Location: Gold Coast, Queensland, Australia

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Many thanks for that bexander. Just what I was looking for.

Interesting that it is so much lower than what I found I needed to use on my Jazz escs. With them I found if I used anything less that 50 ohms, I still got a bit of a spark. Higher than 100 ohms and the esc would not arm. A lot of this difference may be due to the in-built Jive ubec.

How many cells do you run with this esc (10-12s?). Thanks.

Best cheers,
TomC

CX2 2s
Logo10- 3D 5s
Trex600 10s HC-Rigid
2x Ion-x, 1x15s DS, 1x10s SS
10-16-2009 06:51 AM
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bexander
Heliman
Location: Gothenburg, Sweden

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Yes, I was suprised to over the low resistance value.
I am running 12S setup. I have only tried connecting via a resistor a couple of times. But there was no spark.
10-16-2009 11:24 AM
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MAYHEM
Senior Heliman
Location: Detroit, Michigan

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		According to this tread..."How to make a spark arrestor for an ESC"...
you would need a 2.2k 1W resistor.

To complete the equation, you will need to know that the Jive 80HV has 2 - 220 micro-farad capacitors.

Marshall
10-17-2009 01:25 PM
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jrockstuart
Elite Veteran
Location: Allen, Texas

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Lucien Miller really knows his stuff, but bexander talked with Kontronik directly.

Quote 
I checked with kontronik about my Jive 80+ HV and they told me to use a 5-6ohm 1W resistor. I tested it yesterday with a 5.6ohm 2W resistor. No more sparks

Lucien is giving his suggestions applicable to all ESC, but in this case I think it would be better to go with exactly what Kontronik says. Especially since bexander tested it out and found it to work.

MinAir Spectra-G
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Wally Motors/New England Heli/DL Canopies
10-17-2009 02:53 PM
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MAYHEM
Senior Heliman
Location: Detroit, Michigan

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		I just tried a 2.2k resistor...

With the bullet unplugged, nothing happens. I waited about 10-12 seconds for the capacitors to load up, and nothing. Then when you plug the bullet together....BANG....HUGE spark, bigger than normal. Also, the ESC never arms.

So, as smart as Lucien may be, he IS NOT correct when it comes to a Jive ESC. Just thought I'd share my findings

Guess I'll have to go find a 5.6 OHM resistor...

Marshall
10-17-2009 04:31 PM
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e-Electric Motors & Controllers > Anyone using Kontronik Jive Escs with a Spark Arrester?
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