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JR-Spektrum . E-flite . Fast Lad Performance

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Aerobatic FAI F3C Contest > Schedule "P"
 
 
GM1
Elite Veteran
Location: Tallahassee, Florida US

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		I have started working on "P" schedule for F3C. This one does not have the "pucker factor" in learning that I went through when learning "B" and "C" schedules. All the maneuvers seem to be pretty non-threatening as far as hitting the ground but, make no mistake about it, they are HARD to do well. I thought the vertical candle would be super easy....... until I tried it and found I had a tendency to wander all over the sky in the pushover. I still have issues with the pullback with backwards roll but hope I will figure that out as I go.
This is going to be a lot of fun to fly but a lot of work to learn to do well.
Gordie

On a dog sled team, if you're not the lead dog, the view never changes.
09-21-2009 03:17 PM
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Spacey
Veteran
Location: Pretoria, South Africa

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Hallo buddy!!

Hows things that side? Certainly looks like you're having a ball.

The candle..well..yeah. I think the thing that really gets one on that is the fact that there's actually a whole pile of things happening afwully quickly, not quite like you would imagine seeing it on paper. It's gonna be one for the quick thinkers for sure, especially if the wind start blowing whenever I fire up my heli. Hahahaha. I think the key would be here to rather not shoot for an incredibly quick flip rate, you'll have too much happening all at once with the pitch control. Other than that the manuver is exactly like the pushover we currently have, except we don't get a chance to take a breather with the pause and piro. I would stick to my current softened up pitch curve around the middle and gently ease into the positive and back into the negative as I go through the flip. Any other ideas?

The pullback is going to be a thriller for many. I'm really happy doing backwards 4-point rolls or even a rolling backwards figure 8, 5 meters off the deck with my Vibe .90 SG 3D model. But yeah, do a stupid backwards roll way up there? Scuse me while I royally screw this up!

Groete,
Rudolf
09-22-2009 08:36 AM
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GM1
Elite Veteran
Location: Tallahassee, Florida US

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Spacey,
Yup, I have no issue with the backward roll, been doing them for years, but when I try and finish the maneuver, I haven't gotten the collect right to hold altitude so after the roll, it falls about 3-4 meters before I get the vertical line, not awful but not correct. I think I need a little more positive pitch as I exit the roll as I have plenty of backward speed left to finish, I just haven't gotten the feel for it yet.
We have a contest coming up next month and will be flying "P" for the first time. After we get through that, I will begin to worry about "D" schedule. I have flown "D" a couple of times and get through everything but NONE of it looks good. Neither schedule is impossible but it's really hard to make it look good.
Gordie

On a dog sled team, if you're not the lead dog, the view never changes.
09-22-2009 02:10 PM
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Spacey
Veteran
Location: Pretoria, South Africa

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Sounds to me you might actually be carrying a little too much speed through the top? Or you are trying to make the manuever too big? But hard to tell now.

I'm sticking to my original flipping pullback plan for this one, pull up right after crossing centre line so you don't have such a long stretched path across the top to worry about. Small gentle flip to level and just glide it across the top through the roll.

If you have alot of speed going into the last pushed 90' flip to vertical you will need to really jam the negative collective in there for it not to pop up, and then you need to deal with the very sudden stop when reaching vertical so you can let it drop again to finish.
09-22-2009 02:50 PM
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Salesmanheliboy
Senior Heliman
Location: Nashville, TN

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Hay Gordie,

I tried some of the maneuvers (me and Nob during IRCHA) and found the transition was slightly less ....stressful than going to the last set of maneuvers.

I cannot do any of it well but they have challenges that are good for all of us (I hope!).

Also, I think these maneuvers may not be as power hungry as the previous ("C" schedule.

I wish I could be in Huntsville; college visit season at my house!

Tim
09-22-2009 04:26 PM
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Heimypilot
Heliman
Location: Hengelo Netherlands

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Hello all of you masters!

I'm in the dutch national sportsclass for some years now and was thinking of stepping in the F3c scene next year.
I think it's a big step (or a giant leap?) for me to get started. I just started to practise the "p" schedule on the sim. and I already know now it's going to be a long road for me. Every four years they're just a bit harder to do so i'd better step in now than in four years.
Well in any case: I'm just a bit scared to lose my models.....

Have any of you hints and tips for newcomers like me how to get started in this level of skillful flying?

Thanks and good luck to all with their practising the "P" schedule!!

Steven
09-22-2009 09:10 PM
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Spacey
Veteran
Location: Pretoria, South Africa

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Hi Steven,

Sure thing! Ask my buddy/caller DSR on here what it was like to see me try the Cuban with full rolls in the current C schedule first time? We both wished we brought our binoculars! Height is your friend, and just plan, think about it then only go for it.
09-23-2009 01:57 PM
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GM1
Elite Veteran
Location: Tallahassee, Florida US

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		The best advice I can give is to get someone to watch you fly. You are concentrating so hard on getting through the maneuvers that you really cannot see what you are doing wrong. When you practice alone, many times you practice mistakes over and over. I am fortunate that one of my local pilots is a world class F3C judge and he picks up a lot of stuff I am doing wrong early so I get a chance to fix them BEFORE I do them wrong 500 times.
Gordie

On a dog sled team, if you're not the lead dog, the view never changes.
09-23-2009 02:17 PM
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GM1
Elite Veteran
Location: Tallahassee, Florida US

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		P again

With a contest coming up in three weeks, I did manage to get out and fly "P" again, about 9 or 10 flights. I am really surprised that the vertical candle, which by its description should be the easiest of all the maneuvers, is giving me a really hard time. I think it's because everything happens at once, the half roll,pushover,half roll. If you miss anything it gets amplified in the next thing. It's not dangerous, just ugly.
The pullback is getting better. AFter doing it about 20 times, I have sort of figured out how to keep it moving backwards but how to maintain altitude at the same time. I cannot "tell" you what the difference is but I seem to "do" it better now. Hopefully, by next summer, I will have it down good enough to not embarrass myself at the NATs.
Gordie

On a dog sled team, if you're not the lead dog, the view never changes.
09-28-2009 12:56 PM
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Salesmanheliboy
Senior Heliman
Location: Nashville, TN

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Ten flights !

Gordie, you are the marathon man!

Tim
09-28-2009 03:40 PM
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Taipan
Elite Veteran
Location: Sydney, Australia

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Where can I download Schedule 'P' and 'D'?

Cheers!
09-29-2009 01:15 PM
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GM1
Elite Veteran
Location: Tallahassee, Florida US

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Schedules

They don't seem to be on the FAI web site yet but here are the maneuvers.
P Preliminary Schedule
1. Figure M with 2 half pirouettes on all segments
2. Semicircle with pirouette
3. Diamond 3
4. Cuban Eight with half 4 pt rolls
5. Pullback with backward roll
6. Cobra Roll with 3/4 pushed flip
7. Candle with 2 half rolls and a traveling half pushed flip
8. Two opposite 2 point rolls
9. Inside loop with pirouette on top
10. Autorotation with two 90 degree turns

D Finals Schedule
1. Standing 5m Circle with one 360 degree pirouette
2. Inverted Triangle 2
3. Oval 1
4. Cuban Eight with pushed traveling flip on first 45 degree descent
5. Pullback with 3 half loops and two 180 pirouettes
6. Cobra Roll with pirouette
7. Two loops with half roll at the top (ying-yang)
8. Horizontal traveling pushed flip
9. Vertical 540 traveling pushed flip
10. S autorotation

The descriptions are a bit lengthy but some you should recognize.
Gordie

On a dog sled team, if you're not the lead dog, the view never changes.
09-29-2009 03:47 PM
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Heimypilot
Heliman
Location: Hengelo Netherlands

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Hai all,

I went out today, three hours before the rain was coming, and I managed to get a start with the hovering. As you might know ,I'm new to F3c and will step in F3c now because I won our national sportsclass 2009. I think it's time to move to the next level.
However me and my mate had a small uncertainty about the pirouettes. It is not descibed what way to turn them. As I read it it will be possible to turn all half pirouettes so that the MA is always turning tail in.
Or do I have to read the name: 2 half pirouettes per segment , that in each of the four segments I have one and the same turning direction.

Well , I was not good at the sideways hovering. I have to get used to the view as for now I'm always to late with correcting inputs and so my MA drifts a lot.
The 2nd figure ends at the top for me at the moment. MY MA had to be pushed hard into the wind today when it was on top of the figure. I didnot manage that. The MA went the other way...........
The diamond will be okay . I also have to do this one a lot.
Thanks for letting me put my story here. Is you might understand I was again schaking on the sticks, and it's not only because the wether is turning colder here. 15,6C or 60.0F outside. Brrrrr.

Greetings from the Netherlands
Steven
10-11-2009 02:55 PM
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juho44
Heliman
Location: Hollola Finland

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		We got a message from CIAM, that P9 should have pirouette, which lasts 2seconds. Today trained it, and I realized that I need to fly some simulator

PS, three flights total today, 2 with electric Eagle3 SWM AOCC and one with Evo OP II, heads are starting to wobble and electric doesn't give all power anymore, weather was about 5 degrees celcius... Winter sucks!
10-11-2009 06:04 PM
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GM1
Elite Veteran
Location: Tallahassee, Florida US

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Hmmmm.....................

2 second piro over the top, ................ hadn't heard that. That will make this a LOT tougher.
Gordie

On a dog sled team, if you're not the lead dog, the view never changes.
10-13-2009 03:28 PM
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Spacey
Veteran
Location: Pretoria, South Africa

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		I never got the final decision on this one? Is the 2second thing now rule or what's the verdict? I remember commenting on the matter through our CIAM rep but didn't hear anything again?
10-13-2009 04:00 PM
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juho44
Heliman
Location: Hollola Finland

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Finland's CIAM-member (I think member) came up with this message. It's one of many refines of new schedules.

"P9. INSIDE LOOP WITH PIROUETTE ON TOP – (UU)
MA flies straight and level for 10m minimum entry. MA performs an inside
loop with a travelling 360º pirouette on top with minimum duration of 2
seconds. Manoeuvre is completed with 10m straight and level flight."

Don't know more specifically...

Oh, and YES it makes the manoeuvre P9 A LOT difficult than it were before
10-13-2009 04:29 PM
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steviewonder33
Senior Heliman
Location: London, England

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Guys

You are correct. It will be a 2 second duration piro. This was to make it clear for everyone, some pilots would fly a big loop with a slow piro and some would do a fast piro. This way everyone knows what the judges are looking for.

Regards

Steve Roberts

Team JR, Motors & Rotors, SAB, Bekra Fuel, ThunderPower Batteries
10-13-2009 04:50 PM
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GM1
Elite Veteran
Location: Tallahassee, Florida US

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Right

yea, they are looking for me to crash.................

Gordie

On a dog sled team, if you're not the lead dog, the view never changes.
10-13-2009 05:59 PM
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Salesmanheliboy
Senior Heliman
Location: Nashville, TN

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Sounds like the top 1/3 of the loop will need a pirouette in it. Seams a little out of place compared to the other "P" maneuvers though.

Whatever.

Tim
10-14-2009 02:19 AM
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