RunRyder RC Helicopter Topic - logo 10 AP rig, Have some questions.

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Aerial Photography and Video > logo 10 AP rig, Have some questions.

fire_boy92
Heliman
Location: houston TX

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I have a logo 10 and have recently custom built an aerial photography rig for it. (will post pics tomorrow). My question is about gearing, Im running a Hacker C50 14L 1740rpm/v Motor and a 200t Main gear. Im unsure of the Speed control but I know its Jeti... Maybe 50 or 70?? Im running a 4s1p 4000mah Li-po.

Logo is mostly stock other than carbon blades.

Im wondering what Pinion i should be using for this setup. I want to keep things cool, the entire camera rig should be around 2lbs or less auw. I would just be doing easy flying for the camera but want to make sure i have the power to pull out in an emergency situation. Any suggestions out there? Thanks a lot - Chris

06-24-2009 10:56 PM

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fire_boy92
Heliman
Location: houston TX

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need some help here! Can someone just give me a target headspeed on the logo 10? If I had that I could go from there. I searched but didnt come up with anything. I have read through the manual and in the headspeed section it doesn't give a number ... just says it needs to be a constant speed throughout the pitch curve.

one rpm throughout the pitch curve is constant!! I need a real number. I can get on a headspeed calculator and figure out my pinion needs.

I want to make an order today so I can get my heli flying asap. Thanks ---- Chris

06-25-2009 12:20 PM

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fire_boy92
Heliman
Location: houston TX

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First a picture of the heli, Im totally rebuilding it right now to take care of some old and worn parts .... ok ok, i had a little incident, some broken parts. I got the heli used so a complete rebuild will be good anyways. Heres the pics..

This is the camera mount I have built. Its .5" od cpvc pipe with a self designed camera mount.

The camera mount is balanced when the RX and batt are attached. also a foam damper is not shown in the pic. it goes between the two wooden discs to dampen the side to side self leveling. fore/aft dampening is done by adjusting the bolt on the very top where it mounts to the cpvc.

Rotation is 360 degrees and is not limited by wires, all the camera controls are self contained on the mount giving continuous rotation. tilt is using a hs55 servo, it works ok for now but a redesign of the mount will give much more tilt travel.

The camera is a 12mp Kodak. Im having some issues with it right now so i need to deal with that. I also want a downlink so i have to experiment and see if its video out will be compatible with a DL system. Might have to go with a diff cam all together.

Well I typed all of this but then for the life of me could not get the pics posted how i wanted to.... anyways just click on the pics below, you can see which description goes with what pic. Thanks

Any tips or suggestions are appreciated ---- Chris

06-25-2009 04:57 PM

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gtarling
Heliman
Location: London

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1800 rpm is a good target headspeed for AP work on that machine. I do have to say that 6S would be better than 4S when you're hauling a load like that. Have you stretched it to 550mm?

06-25-2009 06:31 PM

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fire_boy92
Heliman
Location: houston TX

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finally some good info, Thanks gtarling. IDK if the heli has been stretched, I havent had it that long and have never had a logo before. I guess I need to measure the tailboom ... is that what you are referring to as 550mm? or 550mm blades? I have a 6s lipo but when I tried to fly it on that battery it was VERY twitchy, tail spasm (hard wags, across the board 90 degrees sometimes) with Gy401 and digital tail servo. Is there a way to tone it down some??? When I fly the 4s it has good solid tail and plenty of power it seems (without AP rig).

after about 5 minutes of flying with the 4s the motor seems pretty HOT. and thats just lazy hovering around and some short ff circuits. thats what makes me think it may not have the best pinion.

just counted its a 13t pinion.

06-25-2009 08:24 PM

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fire_boy92
Heliman
Location: houston TX

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did some quick research... I am running 500mm blades, Im guessing to stretch it to 550mm Im going to need: 550mm blades, longer tailboom and tail belt?? I should have thought of this because I just sold on ebay my logo 20 tailboom and belt... bet that would have worked out huh?

Is 550mm something i NEED to do to make this work or will the 500mm work but 550mm is better?

I need to set up my cam mount and get an auw so I have a better idea of what im dealing with.

Thanks again for your help

06-25-2009 08:32 PM

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HawkEyeMedia
Senior Heliman
Location: Fort Worth, Texas

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I've got a Logo 10 I use for AP, what other heli's do you have?

Yeah, 1800 is a good headspeed, I'm running a NEU motor on a 12S1P A123 setup with ThunderTiger 550's.

Mark LaBoyteaux
HawkEyeMedia.com

06-26-2009 04:19 PM

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fire_boy92
Heliman
Location: houston TX

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Right now only the logo. I started wih an old shogun .. then moved up. Had a t-rex450 for a while. I also built and flew a raptor .30 for a guy a while back. I used to work at a hobby town usa so I got to fly a lot of different helis while working there.

06-26-2009 05:25 PM

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fire_boy92
Heliman
Location: houston TX

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according to the headspeed calculators im going to need to run a 15t pinion. That will put me just a little bit over 1800rpm. The 13t was getting my motor HOT but I think I found that problem. I have been totally rebuilding my heli and I have found that all the bearings seem "gummed up" they are smooth but wouldnt freespin. A little cleaning up and they were as good as new, I guess all that extra drag was really straining my motor. It was hard to tell when the heli was built, they all seemed fine.

06-28-2009 07:19 PM

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BS3488
Heliman
Location: Sarasota, FL

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hey im kind of having the same thing with my Logo 10 Ap setup in this thread

West Florida AP -- Sarasota, FL -- Heli, Full Scale Fixed Wing

06-30-2009 12:24 AM

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eyeinsky
Veteran
Location: Fall River, Nova Scotia, Canada

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Hi Chris

Looking good! If I could make a suggestion

The camera would have a larger unobstructed view if it was mounted further fwd. A 360 pan is not useful with that type of fix gear mount.

The camera video out works great with a down link. It may time out depending on camera setting not a problem just cycle the shutter switch to reset time. Make sure you turn off (auto off).

Not familiar with the logo 10 but this is my Raptor 30 at least it was when I started. Now she swing up to 700mm blades
http://www.vimeo.com/5329254

Keep us up on your progress.
Jerry

Hard job competing with gravity.

06-30-2009 01:45 AM

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fire_boy92
Heliman
Location: houston TX

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Thanks eyeinsky, I noticed the 360 wouldnt be fully usable but I already had the pan/tilt built for a baloon. Im planning on doing something similar to this:

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1030136

I think that is a very clean mount. I might make some changes but the basic design concept will be from those pics.

Thanks for the link Bs, I will be watching your thread.

06-30-2009 01:27 PM

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eyeinsky
Veteran
Location: Fall River, Nova Scotia, Canada

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Chris

Dave has a very nice rig. He also has quite an in-depth post on this forum detailing the build. Do a search if you have not already seen them.

Cheers Jerry

Hard job competing with gravity.

06-30-2009 11:08 PM

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fire_boy92
Heliman
Location: houston TX

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Yeah, I spent a while reading the posts.... Its very nice looking and seems to work well. I had been thinking of new cam mounts but nothing like that ever popped in my head. I just wanted to give him credit for my basis.... and honestly I dont see much Im going to have to change on it.

I have a friend with a small laser cnc machine and I also have turbo cad, Im going to see if his machine is capable of using the turbo cad format and also see what materials he can cut. Im thinking instead of the U - channel I can sandwich 2 flat aluminum frames. When I start the build I will keep pics updated.

07-01-2009 01:10 AM

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gtarling
Heliman
Location: London

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fire_boy92 - sorry for delay - been working! Mikado do sell a kit to stretch the Logo 10 so that you can swing 550mm blades. It might just manage 560mm at a pinch. If you want to stretch further than that, you'll need to look at tail booms and belts from the larger Logos helis i.e. Logo 14, 16 or 20. I think the L20 tailboom and belt would fit, that enables you to swing 600mm blades, but then you'd need a more powerful motor, more cells, different gearing etc. It all depends on your ambitions! FWIW, I'm in the middle of a build based around my old Logo 20.

07-01-2009 12:29 PM

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BS3488
Heliman
Location: Sarasota, FL

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ok I'll use your thread

My logo 10 has the "stretch kit" installed. It is actually a logo 14 boom and a longer belt (maybe logo 14 too?). anyways here are the pictures of the clearance, it looks to be about 23 in = 584.2 millimeters. so it will easily clear 570mm blades.

where is a good place to buy blades/logo parts?

07-01-2009 08:09 PM

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axemanclint
Key Veteran
Location: Cypress, Tx. USA

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Hey Chris,
Great work man! I like to see someone else building there own equipment as well. Here is mine:

First, one quick tip and then one question about your build/setup.

TIP: be careful about the distance at which your legs are spread apart form one another. It looks like you built yours out of PVC just as i did with mine. the first problem i ran into was vibrations and self induced oscillations. because the PVC is flexible and there are no braces going from side to side the mount can tend to start wobbling or oscillating once it gets airborne. I had to go back and completely cut my mount and actually extend the legs to make them stiffer and then add a cross brace to keep the legs from wobbling so much that it induced oscillations on the heli. The whole thing wanted to shake itself apart at first. Once i did this and then also added better supports to the skid mounts and used velcro fasteners instead of zip ties(which were too tight) everything settled down real nicely and she flies excellent now.

QUESTION: on your actually camera holder the box part that the camera mounts to. You have an upper and a lower box arms which are connected with a bolt pin. What did you use to fabricate these pieces to make the box housing for the camera and the upper box housing which supports it and allows it to pan? I like your setup way better than what i ended up doing and it looks much lighter than what mine is also. Thanks for any ideas and supplies (like what they are and where you got them from) that you can give me??

Cheers,
Clint

"what goes up must come down," hopefully in one piece!

07-01-2009 09:03 PM

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fire_boy92
Heliman
Location: houston TX

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thanks for posting those pics BS..
And Clint, thanks for you pics and info also.

Clint... Im not exactly sure what your asking so I will just explain how i built the entire mount and hopefully that will answer your questions.

I forget the size but the material is just a lite-ply from the hobby shop. I took some measurements and then used my CAD to draw the parts. I printed them and glued them to the wood and used a scroll saw for cutting. Corners were braced with triangle stock. I made the rectangle that the cam mounts in and then attached it to the upside down "U" shaped piece with bolts and washers. I used loctite and made it to where it still rotates free but didnt have a whole lot of play. I made a rotation servo mount out of the ply and screwed it to the top of the "U" shaped piece. On the servo output I screwed on a pinion from a rc car upside down, it can slip but i dont think it ever has. I ran a bolt from the bottom of the "U" up to the "swash type leveler". First I slid on a thrust bearing, then the "U" piece, another thrust bearing and then a nut. again, i tightened just enough to take out the play. Then a rc car spur gear was sandwiched between two nuts on the same bolt. it works great just doesnt tilt down as far as i would like.

Like I said my friend has that CNC so im going to design a front mount and hopefully he can cut the material i need. If so im hoping to make a really pro looking mount.

I have a Kodak 12mp camera now but may get something else later. I still have to experiment with the AV out and see if it will work with a DL system.

If i didnt answer your question let me know --- Chris

07-02-2009 02:34 AM

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fire_boy92
Heliman
Location: houston TX

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BS ... Ive been buying my parts from readyheli.com. Shipping charges are reasonable and they ship priority 2-3 day. They always fill my orders quick and are either shipped same day or the next day.

07-02-2009 02:40 AM

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