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Fast Lad Performance . Ace Hobby . Esprit Model

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Aerial Photography and Video > What can an RC Heli do that a Slow Stick can't?
 
 
Burnt Offering
Key Veteran
Location: Winter Wonder Land, Wasilla Alaska

My Posts This: Topic  Forum

Its quite providential that you would ask this question KB. The answer is yes, absolutley. In fact I have made it one of my lifes callings to accomplish this. I will show you where I have come from, and then where I am at now. I have posted a video on the same page as my new plane that shows my early attempts at video with my Slow Stick. And then it will show you where I am at currently. I am very close to perfection. I think the video that you will see is by any standard pretty good, no, I think its fantastic considering it was taken from a Modified Slow Stick that without camera or electronics didn't total $79.00. I am now building a plane that is an exact replica of the one I just built. That one has a wing span of 47 inches. The replica will have an 8 foot wongspan and will carry a HD camcorder. I am having a special camera mount built by Troy Raymond at Envision Gear. The sole purpose of this plane will be video. All flying will be done by FPV with a separate TX and RX for a designated camera man with total control of the camera mount. It is going to be pretty cool. Anyway, just go back to the same page, go down to the bottom, and watch the "Stable video from modified Slow Stick" and you will see my progress.

http://www.pcmdak.com/pcmdvideos.html

American by Birth, Alaskan by the grace of God!!
05-28-2009 01:29 AM
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Envision
Veteran
Location: MI

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Burnt, did you use any programs to stabilize the video in post? Is it raw?
05-28-2009 02:29 AM
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Burnt Offering
Key Veteran
Location: Winter Wonder Land, Wasilla Alaska

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Nope Troy, that is video taken from a simple Point and shoot camera stuck on an stationary Askman Slow stick camera mount. It didn't even have a self leveling gimbal on it. I went at it from a completely different perspective. I went to the mat on stabilizing THE PLANE. I figured it wasn't worth the effort to staiblize the camera and mount before I get the plane to do what I want. That plane and every plane I have from here on out will have an AP2000i stabilizer on it or something equal to that. All I did to that video was download it off of my memory stick to my computer, compress it through Windows Movie Maker to make it easy for web viewing and downloading and THAT WAS IT. No Deshaker or anything else.

American by Birth, Alaskan by the grace of God!!
05-28-2009 02:41 AM
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BigguyOz
Key Veteran
Location: Forster, New South Wales, Australia

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Kevo, that is very impressive!

Tony Stott
05-28-2009 06:48 AM
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KarbonBird
Key Veteran
Location: Australia

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Looks Good Burnt - I'm keen to see the HD footage when available!

BTW can you post the setup with the AP 2000i - which servos connected/radio mapping etc (a diagram would be great). I have An AP available and have been considering installing it on a fixed wing but info on how to do it is scant. If you could provide the info it would be great.
05-28-2009 08:05 AM
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Burnt Offering
Key Veteran
Location: Winter Wonder Land, Wasilla Alaska

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Hey Ross, Let me know when you get ready to do that and I will help you out. I don't want to hijack this thread any more than I already have. Email me or PM me and I would be happy to get you what you need.

Kevo

American by Birth, Alaskan by the grace of God!!
05-28-2009 05:40 PM
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tabbytabb
Elite Veteran
Location: seattle

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		just for another data point.....there is not a single paying job I did last year that I could have used a slow stick for


Tabb
05-28-2009 06:32 PM
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Burnt Offering
Key Veteran
Location: Winter Wonder Land, Wasilla Alaska

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		I did one job last year that required me to shot a 60 acre property from four different angles. I took off from right in the middle of the property, flew FPV the entire time got the shots from all 4 angles and landed. The entire shoot took less than 10 minutes and I made 1250.00 To do this shoot with a heli would have required me to move to 4 differnt locations, some not even on the property. To get the angles would have been a pain in the rear with a heli. The big money jobs are't just for guys with helis. I don't for a second dispute that a heli is an esential tool for AP, just not the ONLY one. One more point, and I think it is a valid one. When this bogus ruling comes down from the FAA, and trust me, its going to. I think the days of doing AP with a 25 pound heli are going to be eliminated or made so restricted that it won't even be worth it. I started palnning for that 2 years ago when the so called "Grounding" happened. Thats pretty much the day I stopped using a heli, and started planning for the inevitable. Thats just my opinion, and the LAST thing I want to do is turn this into another useless FAA thread.

American by Birth, Alaskan by the grace of God!!
05-28-2009 06:52 PM
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talk the torque
Senior Heliman
Location: SA

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Tabbytabb I got on to SS AP because of Burnt, my biggest worry was the payload I was going to be able to carry and the quality that these cameras would produce. Trust me when I say I had doubts about them. I dont have any doubts anymore. I have built more than 12 SS's each I slight improvement over the next. We often fly in high winds, land in places I would never dare land a heli and fly visually 800m away where my heli at 250m was a major panic. Completely solo doing FPV versus a heli of 2 ppl needed to do exact framing. I have a full time AP business which is 4 yrs old now and in the last 1 1/4 years I have only used my heli for 1 flight. The stress was so high with my heli that at the time I decided to go with SS's I was ready to close my business. I think both have a place, I have many flights with both but do prefer my SS
05-28-2009 10:31 PM
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fionn
Senior Heliman
Location: Ireland

My Posts This: Topic  Forum
Quote 
On RCG, somewhere in the electric sailplane section there is a twin boom sailplane that can carry 5 small p&s cameras.
That would be mine
05-28-2009 10:37 PM
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wjw
Veteran
Location: Cape Coral, Florida usa

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Fionn,
We want pictures!!! please.
I agree that having the right tool for the right job is the key.
We have had a pretty windy winter and spring and for that I prefer to fly my heli. The more wind, the bigger the heli
My SS gets fine results in less windy conditions, usually summer.
I do have trouble getting smooth video with my SS in any conditioins but dead calm. Burnt got some fantastic video and not to take away from that because it is difficult with any platform, but look at the video and see just how calm the conditions were.
If I could handle temps anywhere below 50F I would move to Alaska just to fly in conditions like that
05-28-2009 10:53 PM
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blbills
Key Veteran
Location: Provo, UT

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		+1 for pics! Also be interested to see the setup and the equipment used.

Brian
05-28-2009 11:40 PM
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Burnt Offering
Key Veteran
Location: Winter Wonder Land, Wasilla Alaska

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Hey Jay, I haven't tried to hide the fact that it was very calm that day I took that video. No question. It was also very cold! And thank God it doesn't get much above 50 here or you and everyone else would move here to! But Jay, if it ever gets above 50 here I'll let you know, come on up and I'll fly with you anytime!
Jason (talk the torque) is a good friend of mine. Both of us have acomplished some pretty amazing things with a Slow Stick. But the truth is, a lot of my ideas were a direct result of Jason doing them first. His AP business by ANY standard is a class act and he just continues to take a $21.00 Slow Stick and create miracles with it. We always compare notes and the fun has been a very friendly competition to see who can out do the other. The result has been an incredible platform for AP. Both Jason and I have gotten contracts with major corporations that would make any AP businesss owner with a heli drool with envy. I don't care one way or the other if anyone here or anywhere else goes out and buys a Slow Stick and sets it up for AP. My point is this. The Slow Stick THAT IS PROPERLY SET UP is a viable, reliable, fun no stress, platform to do AP. Your profits will go up, your stress will go down along with your expenses. In my book, thats what business is all about.

American by Birth, Alaskan by the grace of God!!
05-28-2009 11:53 PM
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tech1
Senior Heliman
Location: Mississauga

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Funny, I would have said I would take off and land my heli in conditions and places and conditions that I would not attempt with my planes. Guess it is all in the perspective.
05-29-2009 12:31 AM
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Burnt Offering
Key Veteran
Location: Winter Wonder Land, Wasilla Alaska

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Hey Tech1, if you could see the conditions Jason flys in, you would have a whole new appreciation for what he is talking about. Where he lives in South Africa, they have the buildings stacked on top of each other like cord wood. Hardly a blade of grass in sight. He has sent me pictures of the spots hes done aerials in and it not only gave me a whole new appreciation for the wide open spaces of Alaska, but of his flying skills too. Some of the places he has done shoots are cralwing with people, cars, and sky scrapers on all sides. Thats what he refers to when he says hes landed his Slow Stick in places he would never land his heli.

American by Birth, Alaskan by the grace of God!!
05-29-2009 12:37 AM
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borneobear
Veteran
Location: Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia.

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		I met my now EX-client at the flying field today. I expected the usual 'patch-up' work of rubber bands and hot glue.
Well, I was sorely shown otherwise.
His rig was built solid and meticulous. Total weigh = 1.1 kg.
After showing me pictures of his latest AP job (big corporation, no less), he proceeded to set up his SS for Videography.
The plane took off smoothly with an 850 gram Panasonic camcorder straddled between the aluminum LG.
Just as Burnt Offering described, he did four cornered 500 meter circuit, capturing video of the surround buildings, the highway and nearby club house.
When he landed and replayed the video - I was blown away.

MINIMAL VIBRATION. Video quality (SD) was acceptably good.
This guy has been doing this for just 1 month, and he's doing stuff that took me a year to do with the heli.
Where will he be in 1 year?
I will post his video for all to see (the moment I get it).

I have asked him to build me an SS too(can't beat 'em, join 'em).

I would be foolish to scruff him off as a 'minor' competition, and even more foolish to not capitalize on such a fantastically simple yet effective (and efficient) AP aircraft.
05-29-2009 04:04 AM
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patrickegan
Veteran
Location: Sacramento, CA

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		BO
Great video! I love the SS
05-29-2009 04:38 AM
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Louisiana Helicam
Key Veteran
Location: West Monroe, LA

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Can someone show me a good video from a slow stick? I have yet to see anything that could be used for production work. Thanks.

Formerly Viperhawk
www.louisianahelicam.com
05-29-2009 05:03 AM
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Burnt Offering
Key Veteran
Location: Winter Wonder Land, Wasilla Alaska

My Posts This: Topic  Forum
Quote 
I would be foolish to scruff him off as a 'minor' competition, and even more foolish to not capitalize on such a fantastically simple yet effective (and efficient) AP aircraft.

Wiser words were never spoken.

American by Birth, Alaskan by the grace of God!!
05-29-2009 05:57 AM
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KarbonBird
Key Veteran
Location: Australia

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Thanks Kevo - I would be keen to get the setup details for the AP so will PM you.

I have been investigating the use of fixed wings for AP for some time now and have been very pleased to see the quality of the results available. Your work and Jason's are particularly noteworthy in this regard. Skyscrapers in Durban though??? Not the last time I looked

The issue of HD footage is an interesting one too - with much posted in this forum in that regard. There have been some interesting issues exposed during the vigorous R&D activities that have been shared here as well. Some are not only unique to the AP platform - like the "rolling shutter" issue and the sensitivity of the HD cameras compared to non-HD models. I have no doubt though that a fixed wing plane is infinitely capable of producing really smooth video footage that could indeed be "production quality".

What may be a good exercise (if not already done) is to say factor in a HC-5 or similar camera weight wise and do some sums to see the size of the plane needed to carry that sort of equipment. Bearing in mind a larger plane would likely be more stable, bigger is certainly better in this case.

Another challenge with the bigger fixed wing planes may also be the position of the propeller. A large number of AP cams on fixed wings seem to be pointed sideways. Not that this is a problem however it would be really nice to do a "fly-over" with a front mounted camera as is often see during AP sequences.

Look forward to seeing more of your work in the future.

R
05-29-2009 08:12 AM
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Aerial Photography and Video > What can an RC Heli do that a Slow Stick can't?
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