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e-MS Composit Hornet > Microheli Blade CP CNC Head on X3d?
 
 
vrwired
Veteran
Location: Boulder County, CO

I am thinking of doing this? Has anyone here done it yet?
Looks like it would work...

The head looks really nice for the Blade CP form Microheli..

I believe the main shafts are the same diameter..

I think this mod would be real nice, plus my LHS has them in stock!
04-23-2007 Over year old.
 
 
DarkHorse1
Senior Heliman
Location: Gloucester UK

I was eyeing a friends blue CNC CP2 head and swash assembly who is considering possible conversion of his X-3D. He is a newbie flyer and wants the softer CP2 handling at this stage of learning. Hasn't attempted the mod as it requires messing with two good heli setups to leave one (the CP2) out of action. It looks like it could work, swap in with a few considerations.

- Shaft requires a flat spot dremel cut for grub screw seating.
- The servo to swash links will require lengthening 15 to 20mm. This can be done by cutting the heads off long 20mm M2 cap bolts.
- Add 2mm CF rod triangulation from the rear landing gear to the top of the main mast and strengthen servo tray. This is mostly to reduce main mast and box frame twisting resinance when using a taller rotor distance.


If you assume the head pin hole is the new grub screw point, then when lined up you can see that the hole assembly will be quite a bit higher after transplant. This will aid hover stability by moving the mass of the heli lower down from the rotor, increasing pendulum stability effect whilst sacrificing some roll rate ability. Not to mention the heavier paddles and different beller hiller mix geometry, flip and roll rates are likely to be less aggressive but the cruise sport flying should be easier, more predictable and maybe more comfortable depending on your flying style preference. I would be interested to hear how the head effects cyclic handling.
04-25-2007 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
vrwired
Veteran
Location: Boulder County, CO

hmmm.

Darkhorse, I have seen many of your posts and have also been to your page.

Thanks for the info, I am currently running the blue tuning parts from MSComposit...

I have crashed many time with the tuning parts, and they seem to be holding up well, except for the swash is separating!.. It has separated a few times from crashes, and I keep putting it back together.

Just last night I was hovering in my basement and all of a sudden the heli pitched itself straight in to the ground!... after looking at the mangled mess, I noticed my swash was once again separated.

I was thring to think of what went wrong, There was no warning, and it happened very fast, almost explosively...so I am thinking that the swash separated and the blades pitched and drove the heli into the ground... what a mess! Broken boom, broken servo tray.. broken hs-50 (which I have been able to repair)

So i replaced the center of alu swash with the stock plastic piece because the retaining plastic on the aluminum center piece is a bit broken up and weak. Seems like it should work fine.. I dont think it will separate.

This all has really got me back into thinking about the Microheli Blade CP head Mod.

I understand I may have to grind a flat spot, The main shaft I have is the Hardened one made for the Aluminum tuning parts.. it has a flatspot for the aluminum head (not a head pin hole)... You think that flat spot would work for the Blade Cp head? You talk about aligning the new blade head up with the pin hole, so I guess this would be the same..

You say I would have to extend 15-20 mm for the servo to swash?
Wow seems like alot!

I am not quite sure about the triangulation geometry you describe.
I am going to make something to keep my servo tray from flexing (that needs to be done regardless of the head swap)


During this repair and tail rebuild, i added an extra boom bearing to help the steel shaft..

The heli has been running great overall.. i run about 40-50% gain on a gy-401... with a DX7, Hs55 swash and hs50 on the tail. Ar6100 micro reciever (that thing is small!)

I have the microheli cnc tail and servo mounts...

I will post if I do the head swap...
04-25-2007 Over year old.
 
 
DarkHorse1
Senior Heliman
Location: Gloucester UK

Oooh sorry to hear about your basement carnage.
Not sure about the ali swash but yes swash separation is common on the plastic swash, normally noticeable after the first hard crash. CA glue carefully applied sorts that one, just keep the glue clear of the swash bearing etc.
Why they aren't more securely attached in the factory is beyond me also


> not quite sure about the triangulation geometry you describe.
Something like this:
04-25-2007 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
Micro-Maniac
Elite Veteran
Location: Pasco,Washington Formerly: Captain Chaos

The MS aluminum swash is held together by a very flimsy piece of junk plastic - It's metal-to-flimsy plastic-to-metal - I was helping setup someone's X3D that had the MS alum swash and it kept separating so I wasn't able to give it much of a test flight -

My Duzi swash is all metal except the ball so it's metal-to-metal-to-metal and has never came apart on me.
04-25-2007 Over year old.
 
 
DarkHorse1
Senior Heliman
Location: Gloucester UK

I'm probably about to revisit fitting a micro heli ali head and swash onto and X-3D. I've agreed to do the transplant as a favour as I'm curious to see how much difference there is in the aggressive X-3D bell hiller mixing.
07-13-2007 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
DarkHorse1
Senior Heliman
Location: Gloucester UK

It's on! Hovers ok indoors, softer feel, outdoor testing when the weather clears.

Just dremel cutting disk a flat spot over the old bottom main shaft split pin hole.
Use the CP2 servo links, extend them all by 8 1/2 turns.
Copy the old X-3D model on the Tx and tweak the sub trims ch1,ch2 and ch6 all the same +/-10% for centre stick zero degrees pitch match.
Lower the swash menu pitch swing a little.
The only bodge is to let the swash AR spike ride up on the MS AR CF pin skewed over and out the way a little.
That's about it for a 570mm Microheli ali head and swash with MS blades and stock CP2 paddles.

I might even port the X-3D ali MS ali head, grips and blades back on the CP2 to see what it feels like. Requires a pin hole drilled through the main shaft bottom flat spot and shorten the MS swash to servo links to compensate. But what to do about the lower swash AR diferences, as the old CP2 swash AR spkie rides in a slot... eh, we'll see... CA a paper clip or pin to the lower MS plastic swash should do it...

Note you can't mix CP2/BladeCP with X-3D head parts as they use different size balls.

Edit: X-3D with ali MS head, weight went up from ~370g to 400g with CP2 micro heli ali swash and head.
07-13-2007 Over year old.
HOMEPAGE  
 
 
Ruby
Heliman
Location: Augusta, GA

I did it

I did tried it this past spring and it fits just like it was made for the Hornet. Buy it with no fear. The main gear from the Hornet will fit as well and the microheli heads comes with lock pins included or small allen bolts depending on your application. It should be considered a universal head based on the contents of the kit. I continued with my previous setup of using the HDX-300 blue gear with auto-rotation hub that I was using with the Hornet original head so that I can use the more common Trex-450 motor pinions. Do get however a micro ball sizing tool since the links are very stiff. The quality of this head is awsome and it looks beautiful when is spinning. The blades from the Hornet will fit as well. Do also get the linkage for the swash to the servos for a Blade CP to connect your servos on the Hornet to the microheli head. As some of the old timers here might remember, I modified my Hornet with an electric brushless tail. It works flawless. After running this setup for almost a year. I did had a mishap in a local indoor basketball court as I turn to close to a wall and my tail hit the wall. I broke the boom, tore the tail rotor motor wires of the can, bent the main shaft, stripped the main gear, broke two head links, and a blade grip ball to the linkage. This is when I got the idea. Since I have an HDX-300 (same mechanics as a Blade), I was able to compare the two heads. I then decided and bought two micro heli head units. One is in silver for the Hornet and the other one in blue for the HDX-300 (HDX-300 orginal head sucks, correction the entire heli sucks but I can't quit on it). Hopes this helps
09-23-2008 Over year old.
 
 
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e-MS Composit Hornet > Microheli Blade CP CNC Head on X3d?
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