RunRyder RC Helicopter Topic - Spektrum Dx6 Programing

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e-E-Flite Blade MSR CP CX MCX 400-3D > Spektrum Dx6 Programing

catfight
Key Veteran
Location: USA

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oneslim,

Thanks! I wish they had an absolute way of calling out these settings- this is getting complex. I did the changes you suggested and now I do understand that at least :0) I still have the problem of the Blade jumping off the ground right above center throttle and wonder if I have programmed something wrong (that seems to be the most difficult- figuring out what does NOT apply when programming )

01-14-2006 Over year old.

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catfight
Key Veteran
Location: USA

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Not making much progress with this DX6 and not doing any flying :0( I have all of the basics setup and have been experimenting with throttle and pitch curves but all I get is the Blade "flailing" (literally) around the room just barely able to set it back down without destroying it! Don't know what it is I don't understand about this radio setup, or whether changes I have made trying to get flying again (replaced just about all major flying parts) and 2 servos just to test effect. Anyone have some actually functional settings for the DX6 and the Blade (hopefully 36ookv brushless also).
Help would be greatly appreciated.

01-17-2006 Over year old.

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Gary Hoorn
Key Veteran
Location: Annapolis Maryland USA

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catfight,
Actual numbers might still not give you what you are after as there are tolerances in both the Heli and the Radio. If this is your first attempt at setting up a CCPM Heli go to the link below and read my post. It is the second one down. It is for a Futaba but the principles are the same. If you find you are way out from my recommendations I would suggest a reset of the Tx and start over. Make sure everything is working just like it should before ever connecting the motors. Verify tairotor operation with the main motor unplugged. Hold on tight so the bird does not swing around on you while testing.
Gary

http://www.runryder.com/helicopter/t225193p1/

01-17-2006 Over year old.

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catfight
Key Veteran
Location: USA

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Gary,

I have tried your settings from the post (actually read it before I even tried). Never seen a heli act like this- just no sense to the way it is acting, jerking up and down while jerking round-and-round. If I wanted it to do that I probably couldn't get it to do it.

Leveled the swash manually with links, everything including balance, tracking, and control amounts seem normal (even collective for normal and stunt mode seem within range of what they looked like before). I am at a total loss as to what is going on with this heli. The only component I haven't replaced is the mainframe and the main drive gear. I did replace the rotor housing but did not have a rotor head when I rebuilt. Have you ever seen one act crazy like this (everything seems normal until the heli leaves the ground a few inches then starts yoyo jerking and diving to the right -unrecoverable). Could either too much or not enough headspeed cause this kind of reaction? I do not have a tach to check.
Oh, I sure miss the St. Michael's crabs and beer!

Thanks

01-17-2006 Over year old.

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Gary Hoorn
Key Veteran
Location: Annapolis Maryland USA

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catfight,
That does sound strange. Low headspeed will definitely cause control problems but if the battery is good check the motor. It should spin up pretty well. The only time my HB acted so strange was when the 4-in-1 was going bad. I know that Spektrum is not glitching. Put on some safety glasses and a jacket and get a good grip on the Heli and spool up the motor while holding it in your hand. Angle the main blades away from you just in case! I do this with my Bee to check settings. Try to determine what it is doing and set your trims accordingly. I tweak on it until it will sit in my hand with out twitching. Then I know it will fly. Check your blade tracking as well.

I am going to catch Hell for recommending spooling up a Heli in your hand but these little things are okay if you use caution. I do not do it with my TRex though!

Heidi and I were down in St. Michaels this afternoon. Most of the places are closed for the season

If you can come up for one of our Open Houses or our Fun Fly this summer we can go eat some crabs together!
Gary

01-17-2006 Over year old.

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oneslim
Heliman
Location: Pittsgrove, NJ

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Catfight

I've got the same trouble, mine moves left when I get about a foot off the carpet. Can't fly outside the wind's been to much. I traced it down to the Rotor Head, (EFLH1146). This will be the third one since September. It has a lot of slop. Check it out, be sure to get new BB's also, same as the blade grips. I hope they come out with this part in metal soon.

01-18-2006 Over year old.

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catfight
Key Veteran
Location: USA

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oneslim,

I don't have the luxury of a LHS in our neck of the woods (beach)- but I think I have some bb's -maybe I'll try swapping them out of the rotor head- nothing else to do- can't fly! My Blade is actually flailing around then diving back and down to the right! Makes no sense. Wish I understood all of the flight dynamics (I guess everyone does). Metal would be nice. I have not tried to fly outside since the DX6 conversion because I can't even get it to hover in the house. Thanks

01-18-2006 Over year old.

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catfight
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Location: USA

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Gary,

Thanks for the invite - I do travel up there sometime around the June timeframe - love Annapolis - I starting my sailing adventures in Annapolis at the Severn River Sailing Association long ago (late 60's) racing Flying Dutchman sailboats. I rode out my share of Chesapeake Bay chop in larger boats until early 90's - decided it was STILL too cold for me and moved further South :0) Just reread "Chesapeake" for nostalic reasons.

About that heli...I did try all that you mentioned using all of the appropo safety procedures. In-hand it seems fine, plenty of power, nice steady pull without any twist. Place on the floor and spinup looks great- liftoff- prang... I am thinking of driving 100 mi. roundtrip to get a barebones Blade just to hopefully narrow the problem down to airframe or radio setup. Could use the spare parts :0)

Thanks

01-18-2006 Over year old.

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oneslim
Heliman
Location: Pittsgrove, NJ

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Catfight,

I do have a LHS twenty miles up the road, and the guy will get me anything I need. But, it takes two weeks for to get stuff from Horzion, not much on hand. I can get it off the web in less than half the time.

The rotor head has plastic stub axls the the BB's ride on, they are what wear-down the most. Take it apart and You can see the wear. just don't loose them D*** little screws.

I too have been to St. Michael's many times. Last August I greeted TS 'Denis' there. Had to leave a day early.

01-18-2006 Over year old.

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catfight
Key Veteran
Location: USA

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oneslim,

Of course that is the one part I don't have :0)Maybe we should be thinking of steel for this part. I do have an esky bell-hiller head I could install- had to ream out the tubulars where the flybar goes thru but I can;t figure out which end of the "see-saw" (I think that is what it's called, it's more like a bell crank on the side of the rotor head) goes to the grips - the short side or the long side - the other side goes to the swash I know. Any idea about that? I can;t find any documents or decent photos that detail the bell-hiller (someone even said they have changed it- maybe that's why I had to ream out the flybar tube).

Thanks

01-18-2006 Over year old.

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catfight
Key Veteran
Location: USA

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I am back flying! Finally worked out the DX6 settings that provide flyable aircraft - after replacing all flying components and all 3 servos in an effort to troubleshoot what was going on here to cause the mind-numbing unflyable wiggly aircraft. The main probles were settings on the DX6 TX and ( THANKS to James at Extreme Hobby in Pooleville,GA) - you won't beleive this one- a very soft tail boom! I finally noticed that if I grabbed the tailboom and twisted it from side to side- that the tail motor moved about 1/2" so I compared to a spare mainframe I had- and it only moved maybe 1/8" - so I replaced the mainframe. I assume that cumulative tail-strikes (there were many) although not destroying the boom actually micro-fractured the lengthwise grain in the boom. When any small vibration started it was exagerated by the flimsy boom.

An additional issue was that I was using the Helidirect blades (the long skinny $16 ones that you can't get anymore)- they worked great until I switched to the DX6 ( I don't know why they don't now) and again thanks to James for suggesting changing back to the stock CF blades- I didn't think this had anything to do with the problem because they worked before and I had actually tried them after the DX6 conversion.

So, my verdict? Don't change more than 1 thing when upgrading at a time and check for a soft tailboom! Also, ask a local expert if you run into a problem before you drive yourself crazy!

01-19-2006 Over year old.

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oneslim
Heliman
Location: Pittsgrove, NJ

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Catfight,

How about a listing of all Your settings on the Dx6?

01-19-2006 Over year old.

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catfight
Key Veteran
Location: USA

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My DX6 TX settings with Green Meenie 3600kv motor: This is for basic flying- I have not done aero yet- need to spend some time with the tx first- feels a little different :0)

Throttle norm
Aileron rev
elevator rev
rudder rev
gear norm
Pitch (aux1) norm

Travel Adjusts are full 100 (+/-)
sub-trim +20 on Ail (have to readjust link)

D/R Aile D/R 0
EXP 5
Elev D/R 0
EXP 5

CCPM ON
AIl 60
Ele 60
Pit 60

TLN 0, T2N 55,THN 100
TLS 40, T2S 50

PLN 40, P2N 50, PHN 100
PLS 0, P2S 50, PHS 100

Pretty basic, the only surprise was when he chose 60% for all 3 CCPM settings! I still do not understand (nor does Spektrum explain at all) how the ccpm settings are derived- what would 70 or 80% do?

01-19-2006 Over year old.

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axis
Senior Heliman
Location: Lone Star State, USA

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Thanks Catfight for posting your settings.. I am picking up my DX6 tomorrow. I never did get my Mamba working properly. I hope to though with the new system. Are you using the same esc and motor that one would use in an 1/18th scale car? Because thats what i have..

01-19-2006 Over year old.

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catfight
Key Veteran
Location: USA

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axis,

I am using the "Green Meenie" a relabeled Castle Creations Mamba at 3600kv (bought from www.ecubedrc.com for about $30 or so). The ESC is a Castle Creations CC-25 Phoenix, it is 25 amps in case I move to some other larger helo and because the motor can draw up to 11.5 amps - I am the safe kind of guy. I know nothing about scale cars- sorry!

01-19-2006 Over year old.

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catfight
Key Veteran
Location: USA

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Axis,

Sorry, forgot about your Mamba. What didn't work? Did it run but not get up to good speed with the stock tx?

01-19-2006 Over year old.

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axis
Senior Heliman
Location: Lone Star State, USA

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No it works just fine and makes PLENTY of power. I have to attach the speedo to my laptop and turn it down to use it in my heli. The problem is with the throttle. I only have throttle for half of the stick. From what would be neutral (center) and up I have throttle but from center down I dont. Its dead. I didnt know if the DX6 would allow me to change this or not. I know that on the car side of the world we can change things like this with our radios. I use a KO Helios EX10 and it allows these types of adjustments. I really want to use my Mamba in my BCP but its a pain to fly when you only half a stick's worth of useage.

01-19-2006 Over year old.

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catfight
Key Veteran
Location: USA

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axis,

Don't scale cars have reverse? Maybe that is the difference between car and aircraft/heli ESC's? I really don't have a clue. You will probably end up buying a new ESC I would bet :0)

01-19-2006 Over year old.

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BikeNBoatN
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Location: Santa Ana, CA USA

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Quote
Pretty basic, the only surprise was when he chose 60% for all 3 CCPM settings! I still do not understand (nor does Spektrum explain at all) how the ccpm settings are derived- what would 70 or 80% do?

The larger the ccpm setting, the farther the swash travels. Set it as large as you can without the servo binding from over-travel. You can't adjust endpoints, because that will only affect that one servo. All the endpoints remain at 100%, and adjust the ccpm setting to adjust travel. If you go from a +60 to -60, it changes direction. It took me a little trial-and-error determining swash values and channel directions (normal vs reverse).

I have my BCP set up to fly with an Optic6, and I set up a buddy's TRex-ccpm to fly with DX6 and both Tx's work fundamentally the same way.

Quote
The ESC is a Castle Creations CC-25 Phoenix, it is 25 amps in case I move to some other larger helo

I have a CC25 in my MX400. While I think it can handle the motor current ok, be aware that the BEC part of the ESC (that steps down the lipo's 11.1V to 4.8V to operate the servos, rx, and gyro) is marginal. I get ESC-related glitches that cut-out the motor momentarily, and when I check the ESC temp, it is quite hot. With the crude voltage reducer that CC puts on their ESC's, running 4 servos, rx and gyro is a little too much current draw. This is a known problem with the CC25. Most TRex pilots use 35-amp ESC's in an attempt to get around this problem. Ultimately, many have installed separate BEC's or Kontronix ESC's. A ParkBEC is the next purchase for my MX400.

Brent.

01-20-2006 Over year old.

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catfight
Key Veteran
Location: USA

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bikenboatn,

Thanks! Appreciate the information. I am not using the BEC- yet- so thanks again, I will keep in mind when I go to trex (probably?)-mainly just didn't want to lose heli because of over-current :0) Got to justify to the wife somehow where all of this money goes :0) I will have to experiment with CCPM values to get the best response.

01-20-2006 Over year old.

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e-E-Flite Blade MSR CP CX MCX 400-3D > Spektrum Dx6 Programing

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