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JR-Spektrum . E-flite . Fast Lad Performance

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e-Ark X-400 - MX400 > z Bends
 
 
enginetorque
Senior Heliman
Location: North Wales

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		only trying to help

No insults intended - it works for me (and my chums who do likewise) so I can only assume your links may benefit from some adjustment.

You don't need +/- 10 (unless you know something I don't - which is possible....) but you might need +/- 9 and if you carefully engineer the servo mount - the links to the disc (ie z bends below rather than above) then I reckon you will find you get clearance) Come ON chaps - you are supposed to be aeromodellers!

two pumps and a squirt
08-15-2005 08:44 AM
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gt900uk
Key Veteran
Location: Scotland

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Have tried it and cut the canopy to fit. If thats not doing something about it then i do not know what is. Ever consider some people wanna buy something that flies without having to modify it? If i buy something i expect it to have been designed so that you dont have controls fouling on other parts. Its bad design and the end consumer should not have to deal with this.

This Heli Will Self Destruct In Five Seconds!!
08-15-2005 11:23 AM
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raptorheli2
Elite Veteran
Location: rip off britain and no changing it

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		me and gt know of about 5-6 x400's. all with different servos and all with the mounting technique suggested ALL with the same problem, canopy hits.

between us we have tried.

tower pro 10g
bluebird 371
naro's
futaba 3107
futaba 3108
align
rc dragon 10g

it's not a major issue imo but it's an issue. the trex suffers from the same thing. a simple canopy re-design on the moulding would solve this.

since you seem to have a line of contact with liteheli engine torque, can i please ask you forward this to liteheli or ark if at all possible.

1. enlarge the canopy for servo clearance

2. bin ALL plastic on the kit. it's too brittle.

3. change EVERY screw on the kit as they snap when you need to swap the frames or something. loctite the screws now at your pearl.

4. ask liteheli for an online shop and reasonable pricing structure.

5. the existing battery tray is next to useless

6. make a provision for mounting the gyro at the back top of the frames.

7. change the motor mounting bolts to allan head ones for better tightening.

none of us here want a flame war, but we would like a UK dealer who plays ball and for ark to fix there issues. for a v1 kit it's pretty damn good. align is now on its 4th gen rex so ark are doing not to bad. just a few niggles.

cheers


www.waterfoothelis.com
08-15-2005 02:34 PM
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enginetorque
Senior Heliman
Location: North Wales

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		poking my head above the parapet again (mug)!

Right lets see - in answer to your questions

1 canopy is tight but not a problem (to me) but ARK have been told and they should act on it (TREX is exactly the same however)!

2 The plastic is poor - ARK have been informed but they know anyway and are making the neccesary changes (they say)! Having said that the only plastic that has failed on my X400s is the U/C and thats after battering it into the planet, but yep - the white stuff is very brittle!

3 NEVER snapped a screw - built 6 or 7 X400's - suggest less force and smaller tools - and ALWAYS threadlock by the way - far better than overtightening!

4 This has been suggested by others - there are problems as Liteheli are UK and World distributers I understand and price depends on taxes duties and VAT etc - all different depending on where you buy from. Prices - caveat emptor as they say (whoever THEY are...)!

5 It is - but the canopy (yes yes the one that doesn't fit) holds the battery in place - never had one drop off yet! 2200 will fit with a squeeze even!

6 Not always the best place for a gyro (can be vunerable in crash) but there is a mount coming from ARK nontheless.

7 I thought the motor mount bolts supplied by Liteheli were Allen heads (mine are) - NOTE these are NOT 2.5mm they are 2.6mm by the way FYI.

ARK as you say are not doing too bad - the TREX was designed by the same man as you probably know but he is now in production himself and as Lichann ARK are not a huge concern, they are a design team, they probably source production for components. ALIGN are perversely a large production engineering company that makes domestic appliances - washing machines and vacuum cleaners in the main - ! (funny old thing eh...).

The "issues" with the early TREX (I have one) were more than terrible - slop everywhere etc but other areas (the gears for one) are now better. Overall the X400 is still by far the better machine and I believe that it will evolve into a really good tool. I like mine - it's been flying since Feb and NOTHING (and I do mean nothing) has broken or dropped off. Total hours probably between 50 and 100 (yes really) - worn out 4 batteries etc blah blah blah.

thems me thoughts - feel free to knock em - just trying to pour oil on troubled waters

cheers back

two pumps and a squirt
08-15-2005 05:50 PM
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raptorheli2
Elite Veteran
Location: rip off britain and no changing it

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		i have nothing to complain about in your post. but i'll answer back the same points you have made.

1. i have never seen a canopy that fits personnaly, so suffice to say it's a problem, if they are fixing it then we can ask no more. good news.

2. i have snapped boom supports, horizontal support, tail blades are lame and the UC lugs break easy (as do the rex, common prob)

3. i ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS loctite and they screws are not overtightened, again, 3 of us with same problem i know of. screws are defo not the best.

4. there is NO reason for this what so ever. if andy could be good on prices then so can liteheli, no excuses for me. just wanting to line thier pockets. instead of thinking bottom dollar they should think numbers. look how many here don't buy there for example becuase of this.

5. i know the canopy holds the lipo fine, but the tray needs to be a tiny bit longer to make it feel nice for holding the lipos. it's no big deal i admit. maybe it's just me as i'm running 4s pro lites.

6. i never said it was best place for a gyro in crashing BUT, the gyro is better there imo than next to the biggest maker of RF on a leccy heli, the esc and motor. it's sitting right next to it there. albeit there may not be problems with it i know i have suffered bad with RF on mine. still, good to hear a mount is due out for it.

7. mines were defo phillips. altough a 2.6 is USELESS. 2.5 would be brilliant though.

as i said, for a 1st go i have no complaints other than that damn canopy. they couldn't really have forseen the other problems other than through use by us. but i'm glad they seem to be listening and revising.

cheers


www.waterfoothelis.com
08-15-2005 06:06 PM
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enginetorque
Senior Heliman
Location: North Wales

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		motor bolts

Just to clarify - motor threads are 2.6 and NOT 2.5mm - this seems odd I know but checking confirms that on all the motors I have here (AON - ALIGN - ARK and a few others - 2.6mm is it. 2.5mm is seemingly what they are but they ain't.

On pricing - well I certainly have no influence there - I DO know how the prices are derived though and it's no use quoting a business that is no longer there as an example - me - I would sell em for free if I didn't have any (if you catch my drift). You can certainly buy for 17.5% less if you care to whizz over to Jersey......!

Do you think that Liteheli's prices are high then and if so how so etc? I have done a bit of research here around the net and when the import and taxes are tagged on - if anything they seem cheap?

there you go

two pumps and a squirt
08-15-2005 06:16 PM
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raptorheli2
Elite Veteran
Location: rip off britain and no changing it

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		ok, this is really simple

heliaddicts price i'm going on as they are ONLY other, sorry, WERE the only other and they paid the SAME vat, tax, call it what you will and they done ok with it. andy never closed becuase of lack of business btw. so don't think his prices were to low as thats not the case.

there is absolutely no argument for this i can see. IF andy had never had the x400 then maybe i could see litehelis pricing structure. but fact is liteheli are expensive. not just my opinion it seems either to be fair.

cheers


www.waterfoothelis.com
08-15-2005 06:22 PM
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Swashplate
Key Veteran
Location: UK

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		My simple question here to Mr enginetorque.

Refer to this website:
http://www.expatax.nl/vatrates.htm
which says:

Quote 

The VAT system in the single European market

The single European market became effective from 1 January 1993. From this date onwards, goods, persons, services and capital may move freely within the eu. The transitional arrangements that apply after this date, for which the 1968 Turnover Tax Act of the Netherlands was amended, contain the following main points.

1. Private persons buying goods in another Member State pay vat in the country in which the goods are bought (based on the country of origin principle). Exemption on exports from the Member State and the obligation to pay vat on goods upon arrival in the Netherlands do not apply


Then how can Lite heli sell at "Cheapest prices on the planet" to European buyers as quoted on their homepage.
08-15-2005 06:27 PM
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Swashplate
Key Veteran
Location: UK

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Why is it that when I ask a valid question, I get a abusive, obnoxious PM from this "Aero Modeller" and not a valid reply here on the thread?
08-15-2005 07:10 PM
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gt900uk
Key Veteran
Location: Scotland

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		Post them up and shame him then.

Engine torque what servos have you not had any issues with and what sort of pitch ranges have you been running to get away from the canopy issue?

This Heli Will Self Destruct In Five Seconds!!
08-15-2005 11:47 PM
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enginetorque
Senior Heliman
Location: North Wales

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		glass houses and stones!

Dear "MR" Rameshpat

the reason you get so called "abusive" (actually old bean they were on the very bottom of the scale of my capabilities in this area - rest assured..) PM's is entirely down to your own behaviour. If you REALLY think you can say one thing on here and then PM me in the way you did without a response in kind then you now know differently. I can always cut and paste YOUR remarks up if you wish - then you would look (doubly) stupid - but I will cut you some slack if you grow up and start behaving (your choice)!

This is a HOBBY man - get a life

two pumps and a squirt
08-16-2005 09:39 AM
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Swashplate
Key Veteran
Location: UK

My Posts This: Topic  Forum
Cut and paste is easy,
Quote 

Hi rameshpat



Now do you wish to continue this childish spat or would you prefer to try to get along and enjoy the topic (and the hobby) - your choice!


See I did it again, Like a tutorial on that.
08-16-2005 09:42 AM
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Swashplate
Key Veteran
Location: UK

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		It would be great to hear an answer the Question though, and not play God.
08-16-2005 09:43 AM
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enginetorque
Senior Heliman
Location: North Wales

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		PRICING

PRICING - is entirely down to the buyers perception - if you don't like it then shop elsewhere - go to HK or the USA, you might do better - (and you might not - the EU bit you cut and pasted is totally misleading by the way - try it for yourself

How would YOU determine a price - here you go - example

1 You buy an "acme whizzo" heli kit at trade for £100 and import it from afar (say Taiwan....)!

2 You ship it - pack it - unpack it - pay import duty and VAT - other taxes etc on it. Pay income tax - rent or buy premisis - advertise it - transport it - warranty it - provide review models for the modelling press - keep a phone and staff and vehicles running - do trade shows and displays

Now then - how much are you going to sell your intial outlay for and stay afloat?

Be interested to know see your figure on this forum old chap - I know what it should be but do you?

go on - have a go

two pumps and a squirt
08-16-2005 09:58 AM
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Swashplate
Key Veteran
Location: UK

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		That's great, Thanks very much for the clarification Mr. Enginetorque.

Every point you mentioned above is crystal clear.

Now Explain this, Is any of the above pieces of expenses exempted when you are selling the item to another EU country?

I can understand the differential of (17.5% VAT) if you were to sell outside of EU but cannot ever comprehend a different price to EU country and a different price to UK.


Quote 

Hi rameshpat


why aren't you at school then you naughty boy (oh aye - it's summer hols innit)


, If I go to school, there a few people who take the advantage and mislead people here.


Append:
There is one thing you forgot to mention: Free kits, parts, biscuits and tea to agents, business supporters and people helping suppress and sideline a constructive pricing policy debate.
08-16-2005 10:08 AM
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enginetorque
Senior Heliman
Location: North Wales

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		WELL??????

come ON Mr Ramesphat - surely you can do simple sums based on a nice round figure of 100 quid?

Or did this one fall straight into your "too difficult" tray (as suspected)

we are ALL waiting with bated breath for your figure man

two pumps and a squirt
08-16-2005 10:22 AM
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gt900uk
Key Veteran
Location: Scotland

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		LOL this is getting out of hand. So much for the z bends . Right why dont u pair just agree to disagree and leave it at that. Engine torque liteheli have the rep now so they need to do something to stop it. If the customer services were superb and ordering was very easy (online) then im sure the prices would not matter so much. There is no excuse for there not being an online sysyem in this day and age. You dont even need a secure server. He could just use paypal. People have spoken its up to liteheli to do what they need to do now. If this is just a small minority (have to say from talking to folks down at 3dm it does not seem to be this way) then liteheli have nothing to worry about and will be here to stay. If however this opinion is widespread they wanna listen up and sort it out.

This Heli Will Self Destruct In Five Seconds!!
08-16-2005 10:23 AM
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enginetorque
Senior Heliman
Location: North Wales

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		out of hand

no no no it's by no means getting out of hand (well not mine anyway) - you boys have to vote with your wallets don't you - if you don't like it then don't buy it is my advice

Caveat Emptor (as they say in downtown Rome)

two pumps and a squirt
08-16-2005 10:26 AM
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Swashplate
Key Veteran
Location: UK

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		I repeat my question:
Quote 

Is any of the above pieces of expenses exempted when you are selling the item to another EU country?

I can understand the differential of (17.5% VAT) if you were to sell outside of EU but cannot ever comprehend a different price to EU country and a different price to UK



Quote 

Hi rameshpat


oi smartarse - get off your soapbox and put a figure of real money up on the forum - IF you can


I am not smarter than you are

Sorry gt900UK for doing this to the zbend but, The answer to your query also lies here as there cannot be 4 pricing divisions as mentioned by Mr. Liteheli, which is a hick up for going for an online ordering system.

For reference purposes:
Mr. Liteheli's reply to question about online ordering system:
Quote 

Due to being distributers with a world wide network we have 4 different price lists. The lists are structured according to residents in UK, EEC rest of Europe and rest of world. Therefore we cannot forsee having an online ordering system in the short term.
08-16-2005 10:29 AM
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enginetorque
Senior Heliman
Location: North Wales

My Posts This: Topic  Forum		STILL WAITING MR RAMESPHAT..........(wanna borrow a calculator man)????????

two pumps and a squirt
08-16-2005 10:37 AM
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